Frame bent on my new Titan

dag0970 · 08-13-2006, 02:41 PM

2 weeks ago someone pulled an illegal u-turn right in front me, trying to cut through my lane and this was the result.

Come to learn, there is a frame cross-member support (or something like that) that sits behind the damage you can see, branches off to the right, towards to the passenger side front of the vehicle, which was pushed in towards the frame during the collision. Evidently the frame got bent as a result.

The other guy's insurance company wants to "pull the frame", among other things--estimated bill by the collision shop was ~$2,400. After the other guy's insurance company showed up to do their own estimate, the bill has risen to somewhere in the $3,000 range, potentially more, depending....

My Titan is brand new ~5,000 miles, with nothing other than reasonable wear and no dents, not a scratch, over that time period, and I am the original owner. So now the ladder-frame has been 'bent', which means the steel/alloy has been altered at a molecular level, right? So they are going to re-alter the molecular matrix of the steel/allow yet again and "bend it back" to fix the original tweak? Why didn't the repair estimate done by the shop's own personnel catch this (serious) structural problem the first time? What are the technical issues with getting it back to where it was when new?

I don't have any prior experience with bent frames. Any ideas, thoughts from the members here? I would be very interested if any of you know anything that could help me.

Yellomantis · 08-13-2006, 02:49 PM

I don't know about where you live, but here in cali, a bent frame is REPLACED not repaired. Talk about liability! The frame on my old f150 was bent when I got rear ended by a state vehicle. took em 2 years to pay up. but I got the frame replaced.

**konigfritz** · 08-13-2006, 03:10 PM

DO NOT PULL THE FRAME!!! get a new truck. Dude that sucks. if it was your fault and your insurance on an older vehicle, frame straightening would be an option. But their fault+ NEw truck = NEW TRUCK> DO NOT LET THEM SCREW YOU!!

Good luck!

DRTYAZN · 08-13-2006, 04:45 PM

First thing, you call YOUR INSURANCE CO. and get their own estimator out to the shop and get it done right, including a new frame section if needed, or determine whether to total it due to cost of repair over value or structural safety hazard! Second, you need to ensure that your insurance co. will cover the repaired section just as OEM, even if they recommend aftermarket parts. Third, your Insurance Co. should cover all the repairs needed (including waiver of your deductible), then they can go after the other insurance company for payment of your settlement costs. In my experience with Insurance Companies, stay away from the "cost less" types unless they are reputable. I do all my insurance business with one company for home, car, RV, boat, off-road vehs., life, retirement accts., etc. Huge discounts and great service, because if they try and screw me over, I yank all my accounts from them and tell all their other clients of their crap.

**Kronos1965** · 08-13-2006, 05:01 PM

As has been said, get your insurance company to do the estimate.

They may however agree that a puller can repair a frame. Laser alignment is done to ensure that the frame is fine. A reputable body shop can tell if the joints are no good anymore. As long as it's not kinked, you're in pretty good shape.

For a frame to be broken at a molecular level, heat/cold via a chemical reaction would have had to be applied to it.

Your Nissan dealership if they are doing the repair will sign off stating that it's OEM-defined as having less than 10,000 miles.

You're not going to get a new truck out of it.

hooligan · 08-13-2006, 05:39 PM

more technical alignment shops will tweak a vehicle's frame to get it straightened and i've known them to do it vehicles without any prior accidents, weird ehh? well whatever the costs incurred by the insurance company getting the frame pulled from an accident that isn't too major shouldn't be a biggie. the frame pulling machine will leave bite marks on the frame which will be evidence of frame damage to the nekkid eye! the frame should be fine after being straightened. at the molecular level it is a bit weaker, kinda like taking a key bending it in the slightest and bending it back, it'll subsequently be weaker, but still strong. now bending it to an extreme and bending it back will further make the metal malleable and extremely weak. so unless you plan on bending the frame repetitively, i wouldn't be a stress bug about it!

sudden urge · 08-13-2006, 07:19 PM

I totally agree with hooligan.

dag0970 · 08-15-2006, 12:12 PM

Well (.....) thank-you for weighing in guys.

The consensus appears to be that I am basically stuck with a new Truck with a bent (collision) and then essentially re-bent (pulled) frame. Apparently, there is some kind of limited recourse available through small-claims court in the state I live in, provided I can argue the case effectively that the fair-market value of the truck--for resale or trade-in purposes--has been effectively diminished. Which, of course, it has.

So I dunno. Bum deal.

spidy · 08-15-2006, 01:49 PM

i'm going with kronos. being involved in a much more serious accident (http://www.titantalk.com/forums/atta...g?d=1155309235) than yourself, the body shop manager at the local ford dealer said that he could straighten my frame and make it stronger than new was my indication of whether or not i was going to get a new frame. i totally believe that he could have made the frame stronger (through boxing it, adding additional crossmember supports), but that's not what you want to hear.

so your truck was involved in a accident, it happens and thankfully wasn't that $$$ to fix. talk to your repair shop guy and see what he can do for you reinforcing the area if you are concerned. worse case you go back to the insurance company with additional bills. in either case, it sucks you were in an accident and good luck.

dag0970 · 08-16-2006, 08:53 PM

Thank-you to all!! who responded to my question with different insights, perspectives, and experiences. What an awesome forum!!

baseballfanz · 08-17-2006, 08:37 AM

Even if they can pull the frame, what's going to happen when you go to sell the truck. If they pay to pull the frame they need to pay you some money for "Loss of vaule" also. I have heard of people asking and getting that money. I mean your resale vaule have just drop a little more than avg. due to repair being done to the frame. Goodluck.

Yellomantis · 08-17-2006, 01:49 PM

Also, being that the frame is now altered, your truck will now have a salvage title. Whenever any kind of frame alterations are done to a vehicle, it now becomes a salvage title. Why do you think "slammed and bagged" trucks are cheaper to buy used than their stock used counterparts? The structural integrity of the frame has been comprimised.

**Kronos1965** · 08-17-2006, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baseballfanz

Even if they can pull the frame, what's going to happen when you go to sell the truck. If they pay to pull the frame they need to pay you some money for "Loss of vaule" also. I have heard of people asking and getting that money. I mean your resale vaule have just drop a little more than avg. due to repair being done to the frame. Goodluck.

Loss of value/diminushed value is a rare situation and few states subscribe to the notion at this time.

http://www.statefarm.com/about/media...r/dimvalue.asp

You drive your vehicle off the lot and it's already depreciated.

The hype has been done by Carfax for example saying that by definition any vehicle with a history of repair must mean faulty or poor repair. That is not the case.

Your vehicle with less than 10k on it according to the Nissan Dealership I dealt with (Southern States Nissan) stated that a vehicle is considered new and signs off that the repair work is to OE specifications.

If your frame was not repaired correctly, by all means you have a case and anyone buying it would certainly buy it at a significantly lower than market value for it.

This is the same for all consumer products, houses, appliances, etc. Normal depreciation is applied AND the cost of significant repairs not done is also added in the negotiations.

Good luck with the repairs and get back on the road to enjoy your Titan.

Stoobie's Titan · 08-17-2006, 02:57 PM

Don't take the truck with a pulled frame.. Make them get'cha a new one. It will NEVER be the same, no matter how good the job is done.. Have them write it up for replacing the frame. It definitely won't be cheap!!

**Kronos1965** · 08-17-2006, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yellomantis

Also, being that the frame is now altered, your truck will now have a salvage title. Whenever any kind of frame alterations are done to a vehicle, it now becomes a salvage title. Why do you think "slammed and bagged" trucks are cheaper to buy used than their stock used counterparts? The structural integrity of the frame has been comprimised.

Don't want to disagree with you but unless the repair of the frame exceeds the fair market value of the truck, a salvage title is not issued.

A Salvage Title is issued on a vehicle damaged to the extent that the cost of repairing the vehicle for safe operation exceeds its fair market value; or a vehicle that has been declared a Total Loss by an insurer or other state or jurisdiction. Some states treat Junk titles the same as Salvage but the majority use this title to indicate that a vehicle is not road worthy and cannot be titled again in that state. The following ten States also use Salvage titles to identify stolen vehicles - AZ, FL, GA, IL, MN, NJ, NM, NY, OK and OR.

http://www.carfax.com/Definitions/Glossary.cfm