Dana's Response about failures - Nissan Titan Forum
Titan Engine, Transmission & Drivetrain Technical discussion about the engine, transmission, and drivetrain.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
#1 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 04:41 PM
Registered User
 
Shane06fl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Apopka FL
Posts: 3,797
Thanks: 240
Thanked 664 Times in 492 Posts
iTrader Score: 1 reviews
Dana's Response about failures

last week I emailed Dana asking about the failure problem and axle seal leaks. In a few days I had response. I asked this person if I could post his comments here and said it was fine. He also wants to here about the failures and what kind of driving conditions has the truck been under for the differential to fail. I also sent him a link to this site with a direct link to some of the threads about the failures and the leaks.

Here is the response

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Shane,

I received and read your information regarding your concerns on both your trucks. I work in Dana Warranty and conduct warranty teardown analysis on Nissan axles, as well as other programs. I will answer your questions the best I can, here they are:

1) Why have both your trucks had wheel seals replaced?

- Model year 2004-2007 Titans have the same axle shaft assembly design (includes wheel seal). It is common knowledge in our warranty that these seals tend to have oil leaks and/or grease seepage from excess wheel bearing grease being applied at our plant. Dana Corporation is in process of testing this design to find its flaws and hopefully come out with a better axle shaft assembly replacement for service axles of model year 2004-2007. In model year 2008+, the axle shaft assembly design has changed with a larger shaft, larger wheel bearing, different wheel seal and added dust deflector. However, we are having some leaks reported with the 2008+ design as well, we are working on solving this issue as soon as possible. Nissan is pushing Dana Corporation very hard to resolve this wheel seal leak issue.

2) Why are there axle assembly failures?

- Each model year has its own issues as there are small design changes, sometimes none between them. Your model year is 2005 for both trucks, I will concentrate on this. You should have the aluminum cover plates on both your axles, which goes directly with the 75W-140 synthetic gear lube implementation, both improving axle sump temperatures and providing a better cover seal. The steel plates had some cover leak issues. Also, from November 2005 and prior, there are some issues with noisy or differential failures (axle assembly internals - include diff case assembly & gearset). Basically, if you have a catastrophic failure, you do need a new axle assembly as the cause is more than likely a carrier housing issue we have found. I suggest getting a post November 2005 axle build date as a replacement, as the issue was fixed then. I have seen a few standard/open differentials break from overload, that is the only other catastrophic issue I have seen. I can not honestly answer what the cause was for overload conditions are, as I am not the driver, I would like to know under what conditions they failed first-hand. As I stated before, wheel seal leaks are still an issue in model year 2005 as well.

3) You tow 5,500 lbs. or less, anything you can do to prevent axle assembly failure?

- Remove both your rear axle assembly covers and make sure the differential internals look okay. Also, grab the ring gear and move it wheelend-to-wheelend and if there is no play, you are fine (otherwise have it replaced with November 2005+ axle assembly if possible).
- Assuming both your axle assemblies checked out fine, keep them and if you have wheel seal leaks, get the axle shaft assemblies replaced only. This keeps you with less variables.
- Change gear lube appropriately and use the factory 75W-140 synthetic or anything better aftermarket to keep the fluid fresh. Pay attention to magnetic drain plug when changing lube as a status check, wipe it clean with every change to get any early indication.
- Send me a photo or email me all the information contained on the sticker you should have for each axle assembly near the carrier pinion nose area.

Sticker has information, such as:

Axle serial # (ex. 0410602098053)
Nissan part # 43001-ZH04B
Dana part # 606886-4
Ratio 3.357, 3.36, 2.937 or 2.94


Hope this helps, please keep me updated via email with your Nissan Titans as I would like an owner's perspective.

2005 Titan KC SE ***Sold 9/6/14***
Big Tow
4x4 SE
Deep Water
2005 Titan CC
Big Tow
4x4 SE
Silver

New Ride
2013 Chevy Silverado LT Z71 CC short bed
5.3L LC9 engine
Heavy duty tow package/cooling
4wd
loaded to the gills
mirrors sucks (for now)

2004 Keystone 24RS

---------------------------------------------------

Last edited by Shane06fl; 11-05-2007 at 12:54 PM.
Shane06fl is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#2 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 04:47 PM
Registered User
 
TitanBlue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Annapolis, MD
Posts: 6,097
Thanks: 1,743
Thanked 907 Times in 622 Posts
iTrader Score: 3 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Very nice post, thanks for the info.

2006 XE CC Pref Pkg BT with AEM Brute Force CAI, PowerAid TB Spacer, TB Reversed Valve ByPass Mod, 2007+ Intake, JBA Headers, MagnaFlow 24" Muffler, 2008+ Rear Axle, Stillen: F & R Sway Bars, Black Diff Cover, Engine Dress Up Kit, 4 pc StreetScene SS Mesh Grille, PRG End Links, Street Traction Bars & Shackles, UpRev Osiris Tuner 93 Performance Tuned, 18" SE Rims, Functional Hood Scoop ...


IRC VK56 Member "Special Operations"

MD Chapter Director
TitanBlue is offline  
#3 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 04:51 PM
Registered User
 
Delta15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Eastern, PA
Posts: 574
Thanks: 1
Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts
iTrader Score: 1 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Im glad dana was so responsive

great info shane!
Delta15 is offline  
#4 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 05:08 PM
Registered User
 
yamatitan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Posts: 2,990
Thanks: 89
Thanked 314 Times in 260 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

awsome sounds like they are trying a little atleast.
yamatitan is offline  
#5 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 05:17 PM
Registered User
 
54warrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Greensburg, PA
Posts: 5,717
Thanks: 370
Thanked 665 Times in 319 Posts
iTrader Score: 2 reviews
Send a message via AIM to 54warrior
Re: Dana's Response about failures

This should be a Sticky!!

Truck: 05 CC SE 4x4
Performance/Drivetrain: JBA CAtback w/ 2* Advance, PRG Driveshaft Spacer, PRG Street Traction Bars
Suspension: PC 6", SAW Coils, ProComp MX6 Adjustable Rear Shocks, Total Chaos Shackles, removed anti-sway bar
Wheels/Tires: Stock 6 Spoke Charcoal Wheels with Nitto Terra Grapplers-325/65R-18
Brakes: Stock w/ PRG Stainless Lines (Front)
Lighting: (3) Hella 500 Driving Lights
Misc: Husky Liners, Bug Shield, Tonneau, Bed Liner'ed Rockers, Home-Made© Skid Plates, Vent Visors
54warrior is online now  
#6 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 06:06 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 512
Thanks: 28
Thanked 37 Times in 34 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Quote:
Originally Posted by 54warrior
This should be a Sticky!!
+1

Nice post!

Essentially Stock 2006 SE 4WD with Bilstein HD's
12glocks is offline  
#7 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 06:08 PM
Registered User
 
BigJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CO
Posts: 197
Thanks: 13
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Very interesting, wonder if I could just upgrade the spiders, since I like my E-lock and would not want to lose it in favor of the trutrac

Big J

2011 Titan Pro4x
BigJ is offline  
#8 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 06:15 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: NorCal
Posts: 976
Thanks: 5
Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

now that all makes sense, great answers to your questions! Excellent post!

silver 2004 4x4, CC, LE (non big tow)
bought new in Feb '05
LazerLite tonneau
brake fix done at 22k, no issues since
nicest and most practical vehicle i have ever owned!
kman is offline  
#9 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 06:53 PM
Registered User
 
Shane06fl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Apopka FL
Posts: 3,797
Thanks: 240
Thanked 664 Times in 492 Posts
iTrader Score: 1 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Any one that has waisted a axle should fire off an email to Dana, this particular tech wants to here about these issues so they can get this resolved. I have had a few more emails with this same tech and he/Dana seems very concerened about the problem. I need to take pictures of my axle ID tags and email them to him. Take it for it's worth but I think Dana is more concerned about their product that Nissan is, but I could be wrong.

here is my response from this email and his reply


You say this is caused from to much bearing grease?? Will the grease eventually stop running out and if so will there still be enough grease on the bearings? I am not a axle expert but I always thought that the gear lube stayed at the gears and never went down the axle tubes so this leaking had me wondering.

DANA tech--No, not solely excessive grease. I have seen some brake backing plates with just grease seepage, from excessive wheel bearing grease application at the plant. However, an oil leak is much more messy/obvious on the backing plate, like you described on your higher mileage truck that had it drip into the rim. That is more than likely gear lube leaking out. Yes, gear lube in this axle design does flow out to the wheelends to lubricate the wheel bearing as you take turns, hills, etc. It is not much oil that gets out there compared to the carrier sump level, but it does get out there. The grease applied at the plant is only for the initial break-in of the axle when it first runs dry, not for the life of it.

You say you would like to know the conditions under which the rear ends are failing. You can always go to that forum and ask, if Dana would allow that ( I know how companies can be) I can also post your reply and leave out your email so other members can get an idea of Dana is doing to improve the product. I won't do this without your consent. This is a heated topic at Titantalk.com.

Dana Tech--I took a good look at the forum thread you posted and the government site referenced in that thread. I got a good idea, thank you for point it out. I would not mind you paraphrasing in the forums what I've said. I can only say so much I hope you realize as we are in process of improving our product. Please keep in mind, we have to work with the customer to meet the standards/requirements they give us and sometimes we have to prove to them, that their standards/requirements are not high enough for the application. It is not easier said than done however, many hoops you have to go through to prove this and make this happen. It all comes down to money in the end and people are not always willing to give it up easily.

I would appreciate the photos of each axle tag, when you get the chance and please keep me posted on any issues you have. You seem to be fairly detailed in your descriptions, I like that, as I can relate to the product. Perhaps I can learn a few things from the owners in the "real-world" application of this truck/axle.

2005 Titan KC SE ***Sold 9/6/14***
Big Tow
4x4 SE
Deep Water
2005 Titan CC
Big Tow
4x4 SE
Silver

New Ride
2013 Chevy Silverado LT Z71 CC short bed
5.3L LC9 engine
Heavy duty tow package/cooling
4wd
loaded to the gills
mirrors sucks (for now)

2004 Keystone 24RS

---------------------------------------------------

Last edited by Shane06fl; 11-05-2007 at 12:55 PM.
Shane06fl is offline  
#10 (permalink) Old 10-18-2007, 07:28 PM
Registered User
 
krh2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: San Diego, CA (El Cajon)
Posts: 906
Thanks: 33
Thanked 226 Times in 119 Posts
iTrader Score: 2 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Wow, I am impressed. A manufacterer that cares. Nice job.

krh2 is offline  
#11 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 09:04 PM
Registered User
 
70DATSUN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dalhart, Texas
Posts: 396
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Now that was a good post. So far, so good for me at 28000 miles. I hope my luck holds.
70DATSUN is offline  
#12 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 09:08 PM
Premium User
Nissan Titan Status - Premium Member
 
redneckpapa1996's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Smyrna, Tennessee
Posts: 30,593
Thanks: 30,257
Thanked 2,592 Times in 1,784 Posts
iTrader Score: 11 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Mine never leaked until after 50K miles...Good luck..

BEERWHORE



"THIS TRUCK IS AWESOME" !!!........"Uncle Sams Misguided Children"
The Marine Corps is a department of the Navy...>"THE MENS DEPARTMENT"!!!

"ROLL TIDE"

2004-LE-CC-BT-OR-4X4----GONE BUT NOT FORGOTTEN
2012 Galaxy Black PRO4X CC
redneckpapa1996 is offline  
#13 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 09:42 PM
Registered User
 
DezertRunner823's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sandy Eggo, Ca
Posts: 5,541
Thanks: 319
Thanked 232 Times in 188 Posts
iTrader Score: 2 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

regardless of what this "caring" tech says or does, the damage is done. what's the rap on the titan? BAD AXLES, DIFFS THAT GRENADE. you can spend all the money you want to improve future products but nothing can be done to repair the damage DANA did to destroy any hopes of a decent reliability rating for the titan. nor did DANA publicly stand up and take the blame on the bad design. rear axle/rear diff issues popped up across the country the FIRST YEAR in 04 and NOTHING was done!!!!!!!!!! NOTHING!!!!! same issues popped up in 05s and 06s, sh!t... still, same issues with 07s!!! WTF??? this Dana-tech dude, may be the nicest guy in the world but as far as i'm concerned its just all sugarcoating!!! F^CK daNA and their crappy-designed 44 for the titan!!!!

DezertRunner823 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to DezertRunner823 For This Useful Post:
joecamel (09-30-2011)
#14 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 10:03 PM
Registered User
 
Yellomantis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Alta Loma, CA
Posts: 5,752
Thanks: 307
Thanked 696 Times in 362 Posts
iTrader Score: 8 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan
regardless of what this "caring" tech says or does, the damage is done. what's the rap on the titan? BAD AXLES, DIFFS THAT GRENADE. you can spend all the money you want to improve future products but nothing can be done to repair the damage DANA did to destroy any hopes of a decent reliability rating for the titan. nor did DANA publicly stand up and take the blame on the bad design. rear axle/rear diff issues popped up across the country the FIRST YEAR in 04 and NOTHING was done!!!!!!!!!! NOTHING!!!!! same issues popped up in 05s and 06s, sh!t... still, same issues with 07s!!! WTF??? this Dana-tech dude, may be the nicest guy in the world but as far as i'm concerned its just all sugarcoating!!! F^CK daNA and their crappy-designed 44 for the titan!!!!
Tell us how you really feel hooli! LOL

Wasn't the "modified" dana 44 design a Nissan thing though? Otherwise they most likely would have used an off the shelf 44, right?

2010 Dodge Ram Power Wagon
ICON sponsored, going to SEMA 2011, lots of mods

2011 Dodge Ram Quad Cab Sport
Ground Force 2/3 drop, 24" BOSS 330's, true dual exhaust with 11" Magnaflow muffler and x pipe, Volant intake

2007 Nissan Xterra Off Road
PRG Mini Lift
JBA Cat Back
K&N Drop In
CB Radio

Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes.
That way, when you do criticize them, you're a mile away, and you have their shoes.
Yellomantis is offline  
#15 (permalink) Old 10-19-2007, 10:25 PM
Registered User
 
DezertRunner823's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sandy Eggo, Ca
Posts: 5,541
Thanks: 319
Thanked 232 Times in 188 Posts
iTrader Score: 2 reviews
Re: Dana's Response about failures

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellomantis
Tell us how you really feel hooli! LOL

Wasn't the "modified" dana 44 design a Nissan thing though? Otherwise they most likely would have used an off the shelf 44, right?
yes "modified" but i can't see Nissan saying, "build it just like this". DANA more than likely was told by Nissan what they needed and DANA said, "well, here's what we can build/provide for you"

so, who's to blame? i solely place all the blame on the shoulders of the manufacturer of the axles/diffs, and that would be none other than our nice friends at DANA.

DezertRunner823 is offline  
Reply

Jump to top


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Linear Mode Linear Mode
Rate This Thread:



  Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Taming my throttle response? mchinna Titan Performance Modifications 11 09-02-2007 08:55 AM
Radio Issue/ Response from RF jeff7777 Titan Problems & Dealer Service 13 07-17-2004 03:12 PM

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On