2005 Titan Option Packages Messed Up

[Quad T]

Originally Posted by TriKKy

I was under impression that the CC only would get the down window.

Well that is one interpretation of that Nissan marketing mumbo jumbo.

What exactly was said was "Crew Cab models receive a standard power up/down rear window with defroster."

They don't say the KC is getting it as standard, and they don't say the KC is not getting it as an option. Therefore it is my hope that the KC can be fitted with this feature and it will be an option that can be bought.

[MadMax]

Originally Posted by richardminco

Potroast - your dont even understand basic physics so you think that "just learn to control the vehicle" is an answer? Get a clue dude.

Let's get rid of ABS too!!!

Technology is wonderful in situations where a human cannot react fast enough to a given situation. VDC is a great innovation that can save your bacon in emergency situations. I drive in the mountains in winter when you can easily not see black ice etc. etc. Don't lecture others on how to drive or how to master the art of driving. You are clearly unqualified.

Having driven a lot of vehicles with a lot of different configurations - ive never felt as safe or comfortable with the handling of a vehicle when equipped with traction/dynamic control systems and even ABS to some extent (though abs hs proved itself useful a few times lol)- each system has inherent weaknesses - traction control on ice or when you've taken a car well past it's handling limits and you need to be able to work the slide to bring it back in, ABS on loose or uneven surfaces (most ABS systems will reduce braking power to almost NOTHING on gravel or stop braking altogether on a wheel that's 'hopped' in a big pot hole - where as a non abs car would quickly grind to a halt in loose gravel, an abs car will generally just continue rolling towards whatever obstacle or cliff you were trying to avoid), I chose not to get a vehicled with VDC because i KNOW i can drive my way out of any situation that is escapable, i dont know if a computer can and my experiences tell me that it will more likely endanger me - Ive rented in the realm of 60 different cars for work in the last 3 years (and you better believe i drive the hell out of a rental Caddy) the majority being luxury/high option cars so ive experienced quite a few different abs systems and traction control systems. Now let's say I'm your average CRAPPY driver like 99.9% of the people in this country (and by that I do mean you *points finger) that's never even done a parking brake slide, a donut, or pushed their car past the limits on purpose - I would imagine VDC would be useful, after all; how are you supposed to know how a vehicle handles in a slide if you've never put it in one on purpose? But for me - keep it offa my truck. I'm pretty unhappy to find out the 'limited slip' on this truck is a braking system that prevents you from smoking the tires- half the fun of a big v8 should be laying nice double patches off of stoplights.
Anyway - you're post is completely laughable. YES learn to control you're vehicle for chrissakes - all i need is someone that's depending on VDC to 'save their bacon' driving next to me. and btw - if you're driving in situations when 'you can easily not see the black ice' that means you need to SLOW DOWN AND PAY ATTENTION (imo 'black ice' is an excuse for lousy drivers that arent paying enough attention and WRECK, ie, 'oooo mr officer it wasnt my fault it was BLACK ICE' ever heard that one before? - of course it was the ice's fault and not your piss poor judgement of driving conditions - you should know when it's that cold and be able to spot the areas that it forms in). Glad you like/want the VDC because you obviously need it, just dont depend on it to save your life and more importantly don't depend on it to save MY life.

[Potroast]

Originally Posted by MadMax

i dont know having had a lot of vehicles with a lot of different configurations - ive never felt as safe or comfortable with the handling of a vehicle when equipped with ABS or traction control - each system has inherent weaknesses - traction control on black ice (putting the brakes on while you're sliding - that's gonna help!), ABS on uneven or gravelly surfaces (most ABS systems will reduce braking power to almost NOTHING on gravel - where as a non abs car would quickly grind to a halt, an abs car will generally just continue rolling towards whatever obstacle or cliff you were trying to avoid - I know this because two seperate occasions i tried to stop for logging gates on gravel in rental cars with ABS in a reasonable amount of space and rolled right into them denting the hell out of both of the cars), I chose not to get a vehicled with VDC because i KNOW i can drive my way out of any situation that is escapable, i dont know if a computer can and my experiences tell me that it will more likely endanger me - Ive rented in the realm of 60 different cars for work in the last 3 years (and you better believe i drive the hell out of a rental Caddy) the majority being luxury/high option cars so ive experienced quite a few different abs systems and traction control systems. Now let's say I'm your average CRAPPY suburbanite driver like 99.9% of the people in this country (and by that I do mean you *points finger) that's never even done a parking brake slide, donut, or pushed their car past the limits on purpose - I would imagine VDC would be wonderful. After all; how are you supposed to know how a vehicle handles in a slide if you've never put it in one on purpose? But for me - keep that ****e offa my truck. I'm pretty unhappy to find out the 'limited slip' on this truck is a braking system that prevents you from smoking the tires- half the fun of a big v8 should be laying nice double patches off of stoplights.
Anyway - you're little post here is completely laughable. YES learn to control you're vehicle for chrissakes - quit endangering people like me on the road and for godsakes stay out of the fast lane - all i need is someone that's depending on traction control to 'save their bacon' driving next to me. and btw - if you're driving in situations when 'you can easily not see the black ice' that means you need to SLOW DOWN. I drive as fast as I possibly can manage for any given situation and sometimes that's a lot slower than anyone around me... again LEARN TO CONTROL YOUR VEHICLE

i agree. Some things are great -- like the navi unit, stereo, electronic senders, locking differentials, etc... But I'll pass on VDC.

[MadMax]

Originally Posted by Potroast

i agree. Some things are great -- like the navi unit, stereo, electronic senders, locking differentials, etc... But I'll pass on VDC.

of course you agree - that guys post was directed towards you heheh

[Titan4x4Aggie]

amazing how much miss information and crying there is going on in this post.

is VDC really that necessary? i mean, you have a truck with front air bags, 5 star front crash test rating, heavier than most cars on the road, ABS, brake active limited slip diff, 4WD, and you're going to complain about not having VDC? if all those items (when activated and functioning properly), should be more than enough to keep you safe.

if not, you are not properly driving your car. if you need VDC, the you are either accelerating too fast forward or around a turn. why not just SLOW DOWN and you should be fine. electronics cannot replace a smart driver.

give me a few posts now to reply to some of these false comments and suggestions and point out the fact that nissan can't meet every person's requirements, because that would drive up the cost of a vehicle thousands of dollars.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by richardminco

If Nissan does not understand that one of their main differentiators in this big truck market is safety (family appeal in the crew cab category) and that air bags plus traction control etc. are the key to safety... well I guess they are just oblivious...

nissan also understands that individual, factory installed options greatly increase the cost of a vehicle, and that by personalizing vehicles bolt by bolt, they cannot sell their trucks for $3000-$6000 cheaper than the competition.

if a 5 star front crash test rating, auto-tightening seat belt on inpact, dual stage driver and passenger airbags, ABS, and ABLS are not enough to keep you / your drivers safe, maybe you need to spend some money on defensive driving classes and skip the VDC.

we live in a dangerous world with stupid people. accept it. stop trying to live in a bubble and get out into the real world.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by Hardcore

I'm waited to buy a 05 and now found out that to get a air bag package for my children I have to get a navigation system that I have no interest in. I'm basically forced to pay $2000 more for the truck. I'm going back to dodge again to take another look at the 04 hemi truck. I hope Nissan comes changes there policy with these packages' before I buy my truck.

if a comperable dodge costs $3000 more than a nissan (which it does), then order the $2000 navigation system, air bags, and save $1000 over a dodge.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by lizardking

Nissan if you listening this is one of the reason you won't beat the BIG 3 ever! American we love options every which way!

that drives up the cost of the truck.

you can get king or crew cab (2 options),
xe se or le (3 options),
9 colors (9 options),
2 interior colors (2 options),
4x4 vs 4x2 (2 options),
bench seat vs captain (2 options),
3 sound systems (3 options),
Big Tow or not (2 options),
Offroad or not (2 options),
navigation or not (2 options).

that's a total of 2 x 3 x 9 x 2 x 2 x 2 x 3 x 2 x 2 x 2 = 10368 DIFFERENT trucks nissan must manufacture to satisfy you.

throw in VDC and side curtain air bags, and you have 4 times as many combinations.

you fail to realize manufacturing costs if you think it's practical to have that many different options to meet the "need" of customers.

customers need to quit *****ing when they have to pay more for things they dont want. automobile manufactures cant design a car around one person. wake up!

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by smoketitan

weird I have two children in a very rainy area, and I hate the VDC as it seems to me Id rather control the car in a potential spin, than the computer shutting down the engine. but hey maybe I am a little old school as I learned how to drive cars/trucks no matter the size in manual tranny, all human correction---I guess I prefer that. the first time you drive the truck and the wheels slip a little on takeoff a a stop light and the engienesputters you understand VDC is not all its cracked up to be---ID rather have the elocker

i agree. if you have VDC, you still have to "learn" to drive with it and anticipate what it is going to do.

why not just "learn" to drive your car better and slow down.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by TriKKy

I wouldn't go blowing things out of proportion here. There is NO substitution for a safe driver...period. VDC is a heck of a lot less important than airbags, abs, etc. Think of all the people that manage to get by without it. I don't think something like VDC should sway you one way or the other. It's a nice feature, true, but there are more things to weigh.

so true. if you buy a car you dont like and are not comfortable driving, a car you dont "feel part of", then you will get distracted driving and be just a likely to get into a wreck, something that VDC can't get you out of.

buy a toyota, and every time you drive past a titan you will turn you head, look at it, dream about driving a better truck, and subsequently be distracted and possibly get in a wreck. where was your tundra's VDC on that one?

exactly.

maybe while you're at it, dont get a radio or AC, since those buttons are disctractions and safety hazards.

some people need to suck it up and get back into the real world and out of computers solve everything la-la world.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by Tom Roper

Personally, I don't like ABS particularly, since it sacrifices braking distance to insure you stop straight.

see, this is the miss information i was talking about. you obviously do not know how ABS works.

ABS allows the tires to maintain their maximum tractive forces (about 20% tire slip) by releasing brake pad force when the brakes lock up, an instintanious situation. ABS can pump the pedal much faster than a human, allowing the brakes to ride the lockup threshhold provide the tires with maximum traction by not locking up and slipping 100 %. maximum traction results in minimum stopping distances.

ABS allows an average / crappy driver to stop as good as a professional driver w/out ABS.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by SupraTitan

Lets not forget in the late 90's when VDC was introduced on the R34 Nissan Skyline GT-R that car set the production car lap time record at the Nurburgring. I remember reading about it and how the directly attributed the success to the "yaw stability control". I'm not sure the record still stands but it was a huge suprise to all auto makers when the skyline pulled this off, after all any automaker serious about making sports cars pulls laps at the ring. Its a pretty trick system, don't fool yourself into thinking you can make the titan handle better with it off, unless your dead set on drifting you can't. If you find it to be intrusive chances are your to abrupt with the throttle. I can't believe people complain about it, its benefits novice drivers as well as experienced drivers it just takes a little getting use to.

VDC is NOT the same thing as active yaw control. you didn't say it, but you're implying it.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by GoCougsKev

Well if indeed nissan is not going to offer VDC, then it just shows me Nissan doesn't have their priorities straight. If they want to take a safety feature away, then I will take my busness elsewhere. I have never had a ticket in my life nor have I caused an accident, but I know when I was in my wifes accord and we got cutoff by a jackass causing use to turn very quickly, I know the car would have gone into a spin without VDC. We ended up sliding sideways for at least 50 yards, but that was all and the car was very easy to regain control while the VDC light was on during the whole skid. My next truck WILL have it.

then that's your fault for dodging a bad driver and your resulting actions make you a bad driver. while "ending up sliding sideways for 50 yards" you were not in control, and could have caused another accident, which would have been YOUR FAULT. do that in a truck / SUV, and it will flip and possibly injure / kill everyone in your car.

[Titan4x4Aggie]

Originally Posted by MadMax

I'm pretty unhappy to find out the 'limited slip' on this truck is a braking system that prevents you from smoking the tires- half the fun of a big v8 should be laying nice double patches off of stoplights.

you must also be pretty unhappy for me to tell you you have been misinformed.

i have BALS, and have no problem doing a burn out or kicking it lose around a corner since i DO NOT have VDC. if you didn't have BALS, you would only lay a single patch of rubber since one only tire would be spinning. BALS ensures that both tires spin, like a limited slip differential. it doesn't cut engine power.

wasn't this established on a post a LONG time ago?

[richardminco]

Boy of boy - College Station must still be boring and lacking insight Senior Aggie.

Nice lecture on driving skills and Nissan marketing. You miss many points and provide incorrect information, but that's OK.

1- Nissan offered the right combo in 04. VDC plus the air bag package. It's not that hard to figure out that many if not a majority of those who want an air bag package (e.g. families) are more interested in making the Titan safe ON ROAD vs. OFF ROAD. Combining the air bag package with off road on 4X$s is stupid. Not to mention the fact that you also must get nav,sunroof etc. too.

2- You say that VDC and YAW control are not the same. Well you are wrong. Look at the Continental Teeves web site where they describe their EDC systems which is EXACTLY the system Nissan markets under the name VDC. It says:
Electronic Stability Control - ESC

Electronic Stability Control (ESC) is a stability enhancement system designed to electronically detect and assist drivers in critical driving situations and under adverse conditions...automatically.

See Demonstration

ESC Yield Sign

During Understeer:

In an understeer situation, the front end of the car tends to slide out. ESC automatically applies the inside, rear brake to help you acheive your desired turn. It may also reduce the engine's power.

During Oversteer:

In an oversteer situation, the rear end of the car tends to slide out or "fishtail". ESC automatically applies the outside, front brake to help you correct "fishtailing".
ESP Oversteer Understeer

Advantages of ESC:

* ESC constantly compares the driver's intended course with the vehicle's actual course and compensates for any differences.
* ESC responds to help you drive safely whenever it senses impending wheel lock-up, wheel spin or loss of vehicle control.
* It helps improve traction, maneuverability and stability in all weather conditions.

ESC Assists During All Driving Situations:

* Braking
* Accelerating
* Cornering

Putting Technologies Together to Help You Control Your Vehicle:

* ABS Anti-lock Brake System
* TCS Traction Control System
* AYC Yaw Control Stability System