Need some "sound" advice,

Justintoxicated · 03-23-2005, 05:19 PM

Ok, first off I already Have some stuff I would like to use.

what I have:
Hifonics Zeuse 600 Watt RMS amp
150x2 @4 ohms
300x2@2 ohms
600x1@4 ohms

3321 Echlipse 2 channel aplifier (Don't know how many watts it is)

set of Kenwood Excelon Dual mag components 6.5 inch (Older style)

I have 2 JL W0 12's but I probably will not use them to save space. Looking forward to either JL's KC stealth box when it comes out or else finding a way to fit a 10W7

QUESTIONS:
1) should I pickup a second set of the newer style dual mags for the front (6x9 to 6.5 adapters) and use the old ones in the rear? (might require cutting the door pannels

) Or will the ones I have be good enough up front? If I get a second set I will not be able to fade them front to back since it is only a 2 channel amp.

2) replace stock 6 disc changer or keep it and get the LC6 to convert the audio? If so I heard the pannel needs to be replaced which is over $100 alone?

3) Install myself or have someone else do It? I installed my sub amp in my last truck but I don't want to messup a brand new titan or void the warranty.

4) How can I mount the amps without drilling holes into the truck? This is my biggest concern.

Justintoxicated · 03-25-2005, 11:17 AM

come on guys, I just need some advice about keeping or ditching the stock cd player. And advice on how to mount the amps without drilling into the truck. also some advice on the front component install would be very helpful. Things like tips on removing the door pannels without breaking them, wher to mount the crossover for the components and how to dynamat the doors?

Anyone know if the knock off dynamat on ebay is anygood? If so which brand should I purchase?

smoketitan · 03-25-2005, 12:50 PM

first off man these qustions have neen asked and answered MANY TIMES --so do a search bro

but since you are new I throw you some quickies

) mount you mids to the door for best output and midbass use mdf 3/4" screwed directly to the metal

sammysandbag and bestatchess posted some great pics of theirs

2) if you dont have the stock dvd

Id get rid of the HU (one guys opinion

), runnging a loc is fine and it will work but you get more SQ and control from a quality aftermarket deck

3) you cant void the warranty unless you start cutting wires--dont!!

run your own wires/and power line

4) if you have a 05 put them under the front seats

if you have a 04 pullout your seats. measure the area and make a board. use the stock bolts on the rear wall or use the hook mounts and screw it down

matting material the best low price high quality stuff on the market that I have seen it

raamat bxt

http://www.raamaudio.com/

and Id do it yourself it will take some work time, but save you 300-1000 dollars

Justintoxicated · 03-25-2005, 07:58 PM

thx,

I have an 05
I was thinking about putting the amps under the seats as you suggested but I was wondering how to run the wires to them? Under the carpet somehow I guess? And I did not want to drill anything directly into the truck. When I had my system in my old truck it got broken into like 6 times in a few years. No1 ever got anything though! So the LC6 is not worth the money I guess but I have not sceen a decent looking dash replacement yet so I dunno

+ I like the steering wheel controlls. But I can't play MP3s!

what do you think about getting another set of components for the rear? or is stock pretty much good enough back there?

Is there a 6x9 to 6.5 adapter I could buy for the front door pannels?

Thanks for the link I will order that stuff it looks good.

Got a link for Some Good Power and Audio Cables for a good price

I have not been into sterios for a while since mine last one was already too loud for my old truck.

Sammy Sandbag · 03-25-2005, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justintoxicated

I was wondering how to run the wires to them? Under the carpet somehow I guess?

If you pull up the plastic trim along the bottom edge of the door openings you'll see there is a little wire channel that works well for running wires. You can then fish the wires under the carpet to under the seats. There are openings in the carpet for the foot vents are. That's how I mounted my original amp.

Quote:

So the LC6 is not worth the money I guess but I have not sceen a decent looking dash replacement yet so I dunno

+ I like the steering wheel controlls. But I can't play MP3s!

You can get the PAC-SWIX and retain your steering wheel controls, do a search and you'll see others have used it. I just received my new head unit and SWIX, check my posts for updates.

Quote:

what do you think about getting another set of components for the rear? or is stock pretty much good enough back there?

depends on how you are wiring things up, but overall I'd say no. The rear door speakers are horrible. Fade your audio all the way to rear and take a listen, you'll see what I mean. I got Infinity Kappa Perfect 6.5"s for all four doors.

Quote:

Is there a 6x9 to 6.5 adapter I could buy for the front door pannels?

There is such an adapter, but it won't work with the Titan. The opening in the door is an odd shape and takes a custom mount. I made mine out of 3/4" MDF. I believe Bestatchess tried using one of those adapters but found it wouldn't work, and it won't give you as sturdy a mount as MDF.

Quote:

Got a link for Some Good Power and Audio Cables for a good price

I have not been into sterios for a while since mine last one was already too loud for my old truck.

http://www.knukonceptz.com Smoketitan pointed me to them, and they have the best pricing on wires I've found so far, especially their 0ga. I've purchased nearly all my wires (RCA, power, ground) from them.

Justintoxicated · 03-25-2005, 08:40 PM

ok you guys really have me motivated now!

All I need to do is find someone with a bandsaw (I have no idea how to make mounts) and figure out a way to mount the amps without drilling holes into the truck. (I don't trust my echlipse amplifier so it may need to be replaced later and I don't want a bunch of hole sdrilled into my brand new truck)

Should I just get this sites amp install kit? Which one and how much wire do I need to install the amps under the front seats?

What kinda of tool do I need to remove the panneling and is there any secreats to removing it? I broke my last door pannels a littel because the morons who installed my last system made it impossible to remove the door pannels without breaking the tweeter mounts (Drilled the tweeter mounts directly into the inside door pannel then glued the tweeter in over their work so there was no way to take the screw out.

Sammy Sandbag · 03-25-2005, 08:59 PM

You'll need a jig saw or router, not a bandsaw (it's impossible to cut the openings out with a band saw.) As far as the install kits go, it depends on how many amps you'll be running/how many channels/how many speakers/etc. I found that you need a minimum of 16' (more like 18') of power wire to make it to the back wall from the battery, so you can guesstimate from there. I bought an install kit from another vendor for my original install, and it had enough length for the wire runs to the front seat. For my current and ongoing install I purchased everything seperately, by the foot. I'm running three amps, and there are few if any companies that offer kits for those. If you are running 4ga+ you'll need to drill the firewall to run your power wire, I don't believe there are any existing holes big enough. I had 8ga squeezed through the hood release grommet, but that was tight. You don't have to have any specific tool to remove the panels, but they do make such a tool. I haven't used one, but I hear it makes things easier. See here: http://www.cardomain.com/item/SOU87810

Also, if you haven't already, you might want to read the topic I started about this subject, it might already answer some questions you may have: Aftermarket Speaker And Amp Install Questions

Justintoxicated · 03-25-2005, 10:39 PM

thanks I'll read it tonight for sure!

The Echlipse 3321 is 75 watts by 2 RMS or 300 wattsx1 RMS Way better than I thought it was! problem is it's a 2 channel amp and I want to run 2 sets of components so I'm not sure it is the right amp.

I took apart the echlipse amp. I must say I am impressed with the layout inside but it was a ***** to get apart! I found a possible short (one of the coated wires on the shielded coil was touching a pin where it should not be (if is was supposed to it sould not be coated and it would be soldered to the pin. I bent the pin about 1mm out of the way. It looks like this feeds the 2 channels and only 1 was cutting out so it makes sense. It only did it out of the blue every now and then (and not for the lasdt 1.5 years) but now it should be ok so we will see...

I'd like to get the amps mounted thats always the worst part for me. Hard to make it look clean and not drill into my new truck.

What ga wire should I run for these amps? the 600 Watt RMS Hifonics will probably be maxed out when JL develops a stealthbox for the KC (4ga?), unless they go with 1 10 instead of 2. I figure 8ga for the other is fine.

Right now I am limited on buget Just spent like 7 g's on the truck and I'm not a rich kid. So I will probably Just install the speakers in the front first for now.

Sammy, I plan to run 2 amps, the 600 watt RMS amp and the Echlipse. Do you recomend I purchase by the foot? 40 feet? What ga do I need (I know I should know but I am no pro and it has been a while, and also not familiar with the titants wire channels you spoke of)

Also I'm not exactly sure how to run the remote cable form the stock HU, or do I need the LC6 for this?

I was thinking Bandsaw (my dad has one) + Holesaw, but I see your point! might have to pay someone to do this unfortunately I understand the process but don't have a place for those tools (I'm renting)...

Sammy Sandbag · 03-26-2005, 04:09 AM

This handy program will help you determine the size wire and type fuses you'll need: http://www.bcae1.com/images/swfs/sys...nassistant.swf

You'll need to know your amp's max RMS power and effieciency. If you check out ebay there are some deals on 2 amplifier install kits that might have what you are looking for. Like I said earlier, I'm running 3 amps and a lot of other things that just made it impossible to use a kit. The remote wire is a little tough to figure out, as there is line that comes on when the radio is on, except in the RF unit there is a line out to the oem amplifer to turn it on, but it's not 12v. I originally wired mine off of the ingnition wire (violet) but this means the amps are on any time the key is to ignition. Bestatchess wired a switch up to his so that he can turn them on or off. If you are determined to use your oem HU, then an LC6 or Alto Mobile UI-4 would fix that problem (as well as a few others.)

Holesaw? That would be a damn big hole saw at 6+ inches.

bestatchess · 03-26-2005, 04:40 AM

http://www.goodmart.com/products/85730.htm

Gets kind of pricey and is non-adjustable.

sammy appears to be descended from Michelangelo, so your jig saw results may vary.

If you are clutzy (like me) with a jig saw, you can make nice round holes using a router + circle jig:

Changing Rear Door Speakrs in CC w/ RF

Unlike a hole saw, this allows you to make many different sizes of holes.

This generates lots of dust, so if you don't have a place to work, you could probably have them made at a local cabinet shop for not too much $. My kid's high school has an extremely well-equipped wood shop, so you might check out your local high school. Might be a nice little project for some kid.

Justintoxicated · 03-26-2005, 11:21 AM

oh man, this is getting more and more complex now! I don't really see a way to get the adapters made for the fronts, since I don't really have a template to give to a cabinet shop.

I do not have the RF unit.

I don't know the efficiencies of the amps and have no idea where to even get this information as they are not brand new amplifiers. but at 50%AB and 80%D

it recomends 8&6 However I should probably go with 6&4 so I don't have to re-run stuff later if I get a different amp.

Interesting about the fuses, On my old tuck I just had 2 wires connected to the battery terminial. on that website it looks like it goes 1 big fuse then splits into smaller ones?

Can you drive around with the door panels off? I could not on my old truck cause the window controlls were attached.

Sammy, very good post, Unfortunately I have very little hope of installing this system compleatly myself afterreading your post.

1) I'm renting a room and have no garage, so it would have to be an all day get it done project.

2) I need a similar mount to what you made but have no way to make one, I need mine to Hold the tweeter also, since I hear it is much better to locate the tweeter in the door than on the dash(is this true?). (want to make me a set ?)

3)I did not understand the complications in dynamatting. You have to add sheet metal to the door panel? HuH?

4) I did not understand where you have to cut or drill into the door panels, I would like to avoid this compleatly because 1)I have no power tools, 2) I don't want a bunch of holes in my doors.

5)I don't even know how to remove the side pannels on the floor to run the wires under them? I don't knwo how much of anything comes apart on the interior of the titan and I tend to break things when I rip stuff apart. (again I have to do the work in intervals I can't leave the titan in a garage, it will be parked on the street while I work on it! Or were you recomending I remove the center console and the area where the shifter goes?

6)When you say drilla hole in the firewall, you mean I have to drill a huge hole under the dash someplace to run the wire?

Im Really confused now my last install was no where near this complex!

I'm thinking about having a shop drill the hole through the firewall (since I don't have a drill and I want it to be done the best it can be. I guess I want to run 0 Ga through the firewall then split that power for the 2 amps 4ga and 8ga?

I also Need to find a shop that can make me the adapters, or I could pay someone on this forum to make some?

If I can overcome these 2 issues I should have no trouble with the rest after I figure out the dynamtting and how to remove the pannels. Also Need to figure out where to wire the remote wire to I don' really understand. I'll probably keep the stock CD player for a while and go with the $150 LC6 for the time being. Perhaps later I can get a real deck.

Sammy Sandbag · 03-27-2005, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justintoxicated

oh man, this is getting more and more complex now! I don't really see a way to get the adapters made for the fronts, since I don't really have a template to give to a cabinet shop.

When you remove your front 6x9's, you'll see they are mounted on these black plastic mounts. I simply traced that mount onto some cardboard then cut the carboard out to make a template. It then took a little trimming of the MDF to get the pannels to fit without touching.

Quote:

I do not have the RF unit.

Good, no oem amp to worry about.

Quote:

I don't know the efficiencies of the amps and have no idea where to even get this information as they are not brand new amplifiers. but at 50%AB and 80%D

If you look in your owners manual, or on the manufacturer's website you should be able to find what class amp it is.

Quote:

it recomends 8&6 However I should probably go with 6&4 so I don't have to re-run stuff later if I get a different amp.

You'll probably have a hard time finding 6ga, so just 4 and 4 would be best.

Quote:

Interesting about the fuses, On my old tuck I just had 2 wires connected to the battery terminial. on that website it looks like it goes 1 big fuse then splits into smaller ones?

This keeps you from having to run two seperate wires through the firewall. Just run one wire into the cabin to a fused distributor block then to your amps.

Quote:

Can you drive around with the door panels off? I could not on my old truck cause the window controlls were attached.

Sure you can, hell I've been driving around without mine for the past 4 weeks or so, I just finished the doors on Friday. To operate the windows you just need to plug the switch back in. The remote door lock/unlock will work regardless.

Quote:

1) I'm renting a room and have no garage, so it would have to be an all day get it done project.

I'd be amazed if you can finish it in one day. Like I said it's been several weeks for me, and still not done. Of course I only get to work on it on the weekends and I've spent a lot of time waiting for parts to come in the mail.

Quote:

2) I need a similar mount to what you made but have no way to make one, I need mine to Hold the tweeter also, since I hear it is much better to locate the tweeter in the door than on the dash(is this true?). (want to make me a set ?)

I don't know about that, I would think it wouldn't be good to have them mounted right next to eachother. If you want to still mount them in the door, most tweeters come with several mounting options, like a flush mount. Of course you'd have to drill your door panel for that. I just mounted all my tweeters in the stock locations. I only had to cut the little oem grills to mount them, and those can be easily replaced.

Quote:

3)I did not understand the complications in dynamatting. You have to add sheet metal to the door panel? HuH?

No, I was just thinking out loud as far as the best way to cover the large openings in the door panels. I took Smoketitan's advice and just covered the holes with at least two layers of mat.

Quote:

4) I did not understand where you have to cut or drill into the door panels, I would like to avoid this compleatly because 1)I have no power tools, 2) I don't want a bunch of holes in my doors.

I'm not sure where you read that, as it's not necissary to drill or cut the doors anywhere. I did widen the factory speaker screw holes just a fraction of an inch to get my 1/4" bolts through, but you can just use a smaller bolt for mounting your speakers.

Quote:

5)I don't even know how to remove the side pannels on the floor to run the wires under them? I don't knwo how much of anything comes apart on the interior of the titan and I tend to break things when I rip stuff apart. (again I have to do the work in intervals I can't leave the titan in a garage, it will be parked on the street while I work on it! Or were you recomending I remove the center console and the area where the shifter goes?

Smoketitan wrote instructions on how to remove the door panels here: HOW TO REMOVE THE DOORS --simple instructions

Bestatchess wrote instructions on how to remove the center console here: Console Removal & Acoustic Insulation

Everything pretty much just snaps apart or together. Just take your time and don't force anything.

Quote:

6)When you say drilla hole in the firewall, you mean I have to drill a huge hole under the dash someplace to run the wire?

Well you gotta get power from the battery some how. I ran 0ga from the battery to the back wall. I bought a firewall grommet which required a 1" hole and I used a hole saw to cut a hole just above the passenger side foot well. I'll try and get some pictures posted to help illustrate.

Quote:

If I can overcome these 2 issues I should have no trouble with the rest after I figure out the dynamtting and how to remove the pannels. Also Need to figure out where to wire the remote wire to I don' really understand. I'll probably keep the stock CD player for a while and go with the $150 LC6 for the time being. Perhaps later I can get a real deck.

The ignition switch line to the radio is pin number 10 on the M43 plug and is a violet colored wire. Just keep in mind that you won't get very much signal strength from the factory HU, and the LC6 does not have a built in line driver. You might want to look at the Alto Mobile UI-4, which should be available by the time you get started: http://www.altomobile.com/html/accessories.html

Justintoxicated · 03-27-2005, 04:54 PM

AMP KITS:
Which one of these?

Fosgate Kit $99

Audio Pipe Kit $45

Stinger Kit $69

Then there is the canadian kit you linked me to but I don't think it includes the fuse block but I'm not sure how important the fuse black is to be included. I know ordering from canada things tend to get stuck in customs. But if you recomend that kit then that is an option also.

Then I need to pick some battery terminal stuff right? I need a 0 ga battery terminal for just the positive side? Where is the best place to ground the amps to? How come you used 2 terminals?

AMP MOUNTING:
I have the KC not the CC truck so I don't think there is room to mount the amps to the back wall like you did right? So my next best bet is to mount them under the seats? (one amp per seat?) Is there a way to mount them without drilling self tapping screws into the truck?

WIRING:
I guess I could hide the UI/4 under the dash? Im not sure exactly how it works?

Sounds like it might require cutting factory speaker wires to use as inputs into the UI/4 (one set of factory wires for the front input and one set of factory wires for the rear input? or do I need to run all 4 sets of wires into it to fade left right back forward? It is hard to tell from the pictures) On the site. if I spliced another set of speaker wires into the rear channels could I still power the rear speakers off the stock HU? (i'm not sure what to do with the rear speakers or doors yet, I may run front and rears in parallel or in series into my 2 channel amp but this will be later cause of my limited funds.)

Any idea how much this thing is going to cost?

I will find someplace to hide the component crossovers near the kick pannels.

I think you mentioned a good place to run the wires (it was the panneling near the doors correct?) But would it not be better to run it down the center console or next to it under the carpet? then pop out through the inner carpet slots into the amps under the seats?

WAITING LIST:
UI/4
JL KC Stealth Box (should be out this summer)

And the end result is a totaly factory looking sterio system that should be 200x better than stock (although probably not competition level, stock HU and only using about 800RMS watts). And the install should look professional because of using high quality componenets right?

PARTS SO FAR THAT I CAN ORDER:
1 Inch Firewall Grommit (the one you listed)
100 sq feet of RAAMATING (to do both front doors for starters)
AMP Kit (after I decide which one)
0ga Battery terminal blocks (not sure which ones, the ones you had looked nice from the kanuck site but are they 0ga?)

Sammy Sandbag · 03-27-2005, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justintoxicated

AMP KITS:
Then there is the canadian kit you linked me to but I don't think it includes the fuse block but I'm not sure how important the fuse black is to be included. I know ordering from canada things tend to get stuck in customs. But if you recomend that kit then that is an option also.

Canadian kit? You must be talking about someone elses reply, I don't recall that. You need to look for a dual amp kit, which should include a fuse distribution block, which is needed.

Quote:

Then I need to pick some battery terminal stuff right? I need a 0 ga battery terminal for just the positive side? Where is the best place to ground the amps to? How come you used 2 terminals?

You need two terminals because you'll need to upgrade your factory chassis and engine ground wires. All that power has to form a complete circuit through the battery, it doesn't make since to run big 0ga from your positive terminal and skikky 8ga back to the negative pole. You'll end up with problems, like alternator whine or melted wires if you don't. Do a search in the forum and you should find some good info on that. As far as grounding the amps, all depends on where you are placing them. Since you are putting them under the front seats, I'd just ground them to the bolts that hold down the seat mounts.

Quote:

AMP MOUNTING:
I have the KC not the CC truck so I don't think there is room to mount the amps to the back wall like you did right? So my next best bet is to mount them under the seats? (one amp per seat?) Is there a way to mount them without drilling self tapping screws into the truck?

I know the passenger side has a few of those plastic nuts already in the floor, probably for some factory option that isn't there. You'd have to pull the carpet out to see for sure. Otherwise you'll just have to get creative.

Quote:

WIRING:
I guess I could hide the UI/4 under the dash? Im not sure exactly how it works?

Sounds like it might require cutting factory speaker wires to use as inputs into the UI/4 (one set of factory wires for the front input and one set of factory wires for the rear input? or do I need to run all 4 sets of wires into it to fade left right back forward? It is hard to tell from the pictures) On the site. if I spliced another set of speaker wires into the rear channels could I still power the rear speakers off the stock HU? (i'm not sure what to do with the rear speakers or doors yet, I may run front and rears in parallel or in series into my 2 channel amp but this will be later cause of my limited funds.)

Any idea how much this thing is going to cost?

It works just like the LC6, but it has a built in line driver. The LC6 is designed for oem systems that have a factory amp that can't be worked around, it's made for accepting high power inputs. You'd have to tap into your speaker wires regardless of what you use (LC6, UI4, LOC, etc.) It doesn't mean you have to cut them, just use some of those wire tapping thingies (sorry I can't remember the technical term) Yes you would need 4 channels in order to fade your audio. You would do the tapping at the HU, not at the actual speakers. If you only have a two channel amp, then I would just leave the rear speakers alone and let them continue to be powered by the factory HU and just replace the front speakers and run them off your amp. Last time I heard from Alto, the UI-4 should retail around $100.

Quote:

I will find someplace to hide the component crossovers near the kick pannels.

I think you mentioned a good place to run the wires (it was the panneling near the doors correct?) But would it not be better to run it down the center console or next to it under the carpet? then pop out through the inner carpet slots into the amps under the seats?