i recently took apart the stock intake and its routed very nicely, nissan done a good job on this one. adding a CAI like a k&n or volant will not add much more then a high-flow drop in to do it just for its ridiclous prices. other then mabe a very slight, most wont notice, increase in trottle responce due to a conical filter rather then the flat box which has a bit of turbulance in it. our stock setup is routed rather smoothly and straight compared to most ive seen, nice job Nissan! personally i wouldnt invest $280+ for a mpg or 2 increase and a few ponies which isnt noticible most drivers and would buy a drop in if i didnt loose it and decied....
the tube going from the box to tb is even and mostly smooth just like a k&n and looks like a good canidate for a CAI BigHawaii Style lol. i just ordered a huge k&n conical filter and 3 1/2'' silicone connector for my little project. ill cut the airbox right after the tb and add the cone filter with my own fabbed up heat shield and intake support. anyone can do this its very easy if they dare to mess with their stock intake. i paid $50 for the filter and $10 for the silicone hose, ill buy sum scrap metal, odd n ends... all in all ill have around $70 in it and have $200+ to blow on other goodies. btw i roughly measured to see if i could use the stock air box but the conical filter would have to be quite a bit smaller hindering the surface area advantage of a conical filter, but im sure it could be done. the filter i ordered is huge and isnt normal stock so might be a bit but when i get the parts ill take pics and post my results.
__________________
let your old age be childlike, and your childhood like old age; that is, so that neither may your wisdom be with pride, nor your humility without wisdom.
i agree nissan did a good job extracting power from these beasts and im not sure theres a whole lot of power left to unlock without something drastic. i might try the k and n drop in filter but mostly i think the truck runs great. the volant set up does look nice but expensive. keep us posted
__________________
04 cc 4x4 w/big tow...........silver
volant cold air , oem sirius tuner, Zoomers exhaust, wade in channel visors, chrome tailgate piece ,05 finned diff cover,leather console lid, tailgate torsion bar,22 inch akuzu bounce, 305/45/22 nitto 420 extremes, mccullough hid's,05 active headrests , truxedo low profile,stillen front sway bar, painted lund interceptor, cr lawrence rear power slider,armada painted front spoiler, dr coilovers, t rex vertical billet grill, zoomers exhaust, prg traction bars, brake pros monster brake kit, prothane front swaybar bushings, volant vuelights(led), odyssey deep cycle battery, trutrac on order.....(INSTALLED)
STILLEN SUPERCHARGED 425rwhp 431rwtq (before headers)
What do you think about the exhaust controversy? Banks, JBA, Gibson, stock, or ?????
What mods would you recommend, short of a supercharger, to get more or the most out of our engine?
Mahalo bruddah (We need a shakka smiley!)
37L1
__________________
2004 Titan Smoke LE CC
Born 11/18/03
Bed Extender, Overhead Racks
Hood Protector, Banks Monster Exhaust, Volant CAI, Hellwig Rear Sway Bar, Bilstein shocks
Never argue with idiots. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
-Gambit
i think the power will be in a spercharger. the jba exhaust looks to incorporate some type of baffling that may help keep low end. i would try the drop in k and n and save some money.
I disagree,
I got 16HP more to the rear wheel, look at my dyno under performance mods.
2-5 lbs of torque up to 4k rpms with 2 points that where its even and one where you loose a little isnt a big gain in my books. i personally dont drag race my truck and believe that gains at the low end are most important since i drive under low rpms conditions most of the time, who drives at 5k rpms through town? a drop in k&n will out-flow your stocker and will help out a bit similar a CAI. now if nissans stock setup wasnt designed so straight and direct it would be a different story like my old s-10 which had more then double the tubing as ours not to mention the poorest routing with horrid bends, unlike the titans.
What do you think about the exhaust controversy? Banks, JBA, Gibson, stock, or ?????
What mods would you recommend, short of a supercharger, to get more or the most out of our engine?
Mahalo bruddah (We need a shakka smiley!)
37L1
i know theres been alot of opinions about gains and losses with thier banks system yet we still wait for that precious dyno from banks. there were post that banks said their exhuast gains 15 hp, the most from 0-3500 rpms but no dyno. according to them it provides gains at the low end, if you believe them thats up to you, even if they post a dyno its still up to you. the only way to be absolutly sure is to have to dynod yourself.
there seems to be alot of very sensitive butt dynos here. when you add a cat-back, especialy a louder one like banks then it becomes more of a personal expectation thing. im not saying anyone is wrong, just that their butt dyno's may be to personal taste. when adding a cat-back were not talking of huge gains, were talking about 10-15 hp and torque to the wheels. now if anyone actually lost any power it would be very minor, much less then the gain.
10hp doesnt really put a dent on the titans 5000lbs of weight, its so minute that the wind could zap your 10hp/tq + just like that.
usually the greatest hp gains are at upper rpms and if you compared 0-60 times it would be like a .1 improvement lol, reaction time or road conditions or the environment or tire pressure and many other factors will play a bigger role then a cat-back alone. im trying to say that its not a major gain all in itself to actually feel to the normal driver. your only doing 1/3 of the exhaust really need headers to get that last bit of juice out. even then with headers and a cat-back and lets say a intake, you will only shave around .5 sec off. a chip will definantly help out, especially a complete ecu tuner with preprogrammed inj/ing maps that override the stock ecu but will need to run premium for the greatest gains provided the actual chip company spends 100s of hours tuning for the best maps for power gains and the type of ecu tuner.
i just went out and measured our stocker at every point it changed diameter and found some very interisting things. nissan once again has put alot of thought into it design but like the stock intake they had to give in to suiting their target customers. a conical filter will be a bit louder inaddition to the already louder stock exhaust which some think is to loud already. the exhaust is suprising designed well in certain areas. the pipe coming from the passengers side is 2 1/4, the pipe coming from the drivers side to the Y that is longer goes from 2in and then widens to 2 1/4. this is to keep velocity of exhaust gases at the same speed as the enter in the 2 3/4'' choked up Y. this Y is mass produced this way for cost/time efficieny and is the one major point i see choking our system hindering gas velocity. the long pipe from the Y going to the muffler is 2 1/2 keeping velocity nice and smooth , muffler openings are 2 3/8 and the out end pipes opens up t 2 3/4. it then connects to a 3" tailpipe.
one missconception is that backpressure at low loads will help low end torque. on a new engine like ours which can alter a/f conditions accodingly backpressure is our enemy. no i am not crazy lol your engine already has enough backpressure with the cats and stock headers. ill talk about headers soon. backpressure hinders the sacavenging effect and pushes gases in to the combustion chamber making your engine work harder due to loss of cumbustion effieciency = loss of power. what you want is a low backpressure system with good velocity flow, this is where tubing comes into play.
i think it was bestatchess who metioned at lower rpms your exhuast tubing should be only big enough to sufficiently expel gasses (not exact words ) and that there is no gain without a loss at another point, this is true. our stock system has a major flaw and its the Y, this creates a major velocity gas loss. the stock exhaust may be also a cork, both hinder power. adding the banks kit solves these problems by adding a nice Y collector and low backpressure muffler but also adds huge tubing. i was under the impression we has 2 7/8 tubing reading post's till i measure it for myself.
banks's 3'' tubing is quite a bit bigger then stock which will hurt the low end a bit and add to the high end like many are saying. a larger diameter pipe has less backpressure but what we care about is gas velocity flow and since its a larger pipe gas pulses will be further thus slower = the loss if power, so yes backpressure and velocity is related in a way. the question is does the tubing diameter hinder exhaust flow as much as the stock muffler and Y? i doubt it, in fact theres probably a gain because if the extreme low pressure zone created behind the header by the cat-back. you may gain across the whole band but will not have as of a efficient gain if you say cut the stock pipe, added a nice smooth Y collector and a higher flowing muffler like the banks setup if your looking into just adding a cat-back, with gains towards the low end. id do this but getting a safety check is about impossible now here with a mod cat-back so i have to buy a bolt on.
the jba cat-back looks like a very nice setup, it retains similar tubing diameter (2 1/2 to keep velocity a flowing niclely) and corrects the stock setup flaws. i doubt them humps in the piping are there to create backpressure, since we dont really care about it with a cat-back what we care about is gas velocity.(yes im gonna keep on saying it lol) they are probably there to help silence the muffler. i notice they moved the muffler way back towards the tail end and added the Y collector right by the muffler, interisting since placement affect power also. too bad its made of aluminized steel and not SS, itll probably last longer then most will have their trucks anyway lol. the nice thing about it is that JBA is designed for thier header and actually dynod a truck with their header combo which yeilded very nice gains.
not sure about gibson, i havent seen a pic yet.
now headers are a key player in complementing a cat-back. they work in conjunction with each other to help focus power at a certain point or help a few 1000 rpms out where your cat-back may not be so efficient at. they should both be better designed then stock and not cost anypower loss or almost none at any point in addition to adding power across the band if designed correctly.
after taking time to look closely at nissans work i must say im pretty impressed how close to detail they are in areas other cars ive seen are very poor. itll be very hard to gain over what nissan has layed out, jba has done very nicely and im hoping more dynos from other manufacturers will follow.
this should make up for all the post i missed lol hope i everyone didnt fall asleep now wheres that shaka smilee lol i need a long
i know theres been alot of opinions about gains and losses with thier banks system yet we still wait for that precious dyno from banks. there were post that banks said their exhuast gains 15 hp, the most from 0-3500 rpms but no dyno. according to them it provides gains at the low end, if you believe them thats up to you, even if they post a dyno its still up to you. the only way to be absolutly sure is to have to dynod yourself.
there seems to be alot of very sensitive butt dynos here. when you add a cat-back, especialy a louder one like banks then it becomes more of a personal expectation thing. im not saying anyone is wrong, just that their butt dyno's may be to personal taste. when adding a cat-back were not talking of huge gains, were talking about 10-15 hp and torque to the wheels. now if anyone actually lost any power it would be very minor, much less then the gain.
10hp doesnt really put a dent on the titans 5000lbs of weight, its so minute that the wind could zap your 10hp/tq + just like that.
usually the greatest hp gains are at upper rpms and if you compared 0-60 times it would be like a .1 improvement lol, reaction time or road conditions or the environment or tire pressure and many other factors will play a bigger role then a cat-back alone. im trying to say that its not a major gain all in itself to actually feel to the normal driver. your only doing 1/3 of the exhaust really need headers to get that last bit of juice out. even then with headers and a cat-back and lets say a intake, you will only shave around .5 sec off. a chip will definantly help out, especially a complete ecu tuner with preprogrammed inj/ing maps that override the stock ecu but will need to run premium for the greatest gains provided the actual chip company spends 100s of hours tuning for the best maps for power gains and the type of ecu tuner.
i just went out and measured our stocker at every point it changed diameter and found some very interisting things. nissan once again has put alot of thought into it design but like the stock intake they had to give in to suiting their target customers. a conical filter will be a bit louder inaddition to the already louder stock exhaust which some think is to loud already. the exhaust is suprising designed well in certain areas. the pipe coming from the passengers side is 2 1/4, the pipe coming from the drivers side to the Y that is longer goes from 2in and then widens to 2 1/4. this is to keep velocity of exhaust gases at the same speed as the enter in the 2 3/4'' choked up Y. this Y is mass produced this way for cost/time efficieny and is the one major point i see choking our system hindering gas velocity. the long pipe from the Y going to the muffler is 2 1/2 keeping velocity nice and smooth , muffler openings are 2 3/8 and the out end pipes opens up t 2 3/4. it then connects to a 3" tailpipe.
one missconception is that backpressure at low loads will help low end torque. on a new engine like ours which can alter a/f conditions accodingly backpressure is our enemy. no i am not crazy lol your engine already has enough backpressure with the cats and stock headers. ill talk about headers soon. backpressure hinders the sacavenging effect and pushes gases in to the combustion chamber making your engine work harder due to loss of cumbustion effieciency = loss of power. what you want is a low backpressure system with good velocity flow, this is where tubing comes into play.
i think it was bestatchess who metioned at lower rpms your exhuast tubing should be only big enough to sufficiently expel gasses (not exact words ) and that there is no gain without a loss at another point, this is true. our stock system has a major flaw and its the Y, this creates a major velocity gas loss. the stock exhaust may be also a cork, both hinder power. adding the banks kit solves these problems by adding a nice Y collector and low backpressure muffler but also adds huge tubing. i was under the impression we has 2 7/8 tubing reading post's till i measure it for myself.
banks's 3'' tubing is quite a bit bigger then stock which will hurt the low end a bit and add to the high end like many are saying. a larger diameter pipe has less backpressure but what we care about is gas velocity flow and since its a larger pipe gas pulses will be further thus slower = the loss if power, so yes backpressure and velocity is related in a way. the question is does the tubing diameter hinder exhaust flow as much as the stock muffler and Y? i doubt it, in fact theres probably a gain because if the extreme low pressure zone created behind the header by the cat-back. you may gain across the whole band but will not have as of a efficient gain if you say cut the stock pipe, added a nice smooth Y collector and a higher flowing muffler like the banks setup if your looking into just adding a cat-back, with gains towards the low end. id do this but getting a safety check is about impossible now here with a mod cat-back so i have to buy a bolt on.
the jba cat-back looks like a very nice setup, it retains similar tubing diameter (2 1/2 to keep velocity a flowing niclely) and corrects the stock setup flaws. i doubt them humps in the piping are there to create backpressure, since we dont really care about it with a cat-back what we care about is gas velocity.(yes im gonna keep on saying it lol) they are probably there to help silence the muffler. i notice they moved the muffler way back towards the tail end and added the Y collector right by the muffler, interisting since placement affect power also. too bad its made of aluminized steel and not SS, itll probably last longer then most will have their trucks anyway lol. the nice thing about it is that JBA is designed for thier header and actually dynod a truck with their header combo which yeilded very nice gains.
not sure about gibson, i havent seen a pic yet.
now headers are a key player in complementing a cat-back. they work in conjunction with each other to help focus power at a certain point or help a few 1000 rpms out where your cat-back may not be so efficient at. they should both be better designed then stock and not cost anypower loss or almost none at any point in addition to adding power across the band if designed correctly.
after taking time to look closely at nissans work i must say im pretty impressed how close to detail they are in areas other cars ive seen are very poor. itll be very hard to gain over what nissan has layed out, jba has done very nicely and im hoping more dynos from other manufacturers will follow.
this should make up for all the post i missed lol hope i everyone didnt fall asleep now wheres that shaka smilee lol i need a long
i know theres been alot of opinions about gains and losses with thier banks system yet we still wait for that precious dyno from banks. there were post that banks said their exhuast gains 15 hp, the most from 0-3500 rpms but no dyno. according to them it provides gains at the low end, if you believe them thats up to you, even if they post a dyno its still up to you. the only way to be absolutly sure is to have to dynod yourself.
there seems to be alot of very sensitive butt dynos here. when you add a cat-back, especialy a louder one like banks then it becomes more of a personal expectation thing. im not saying anyone is wrong, just that their butt dyno's may be to personal taste. when adding a cat-back were not talking of huge gains, were talking about 10-15 hp and torque to the wheels. now if anyone actually lost any power it would be very minor, much less then the gain.
10hp doesnt really put a dent on the titans 5000lbs of weight, its so minute that the wind could zap your 10hp/tq + just like that.
usually the greatest hp gains are at upper rpms and if you compared 0-60 times it would be like a .1 improvement lol, reaction time or road conditions or the environment or tire pressure and many other factors will play a bigger role then a cat-back alone. im trying to say that its not a major gain all in itself to actually feel to the normal driver. your only doing 1/3 of the exhaust really need headers to get that last bit of juice out. even then with headers and a cat-back and lets say a intake, you will only shave around .5 sec off. a chip will definantly help out, especially a complete ecu tuner with preprogrammed inj/ing maps that override the stock ecu but will need to run premium for the greatest gains provided the actual chip company spends 100s of hours tuning for the best maps for power gains and the type of ecu tuner.
i just went out and measured our stocker at every point it changed diameter and found some very interisting things. nissan once again has put alot of thought into it design but like the stock intake they had to give in to suiting their target customers. a conical filter will be a bit louder inaddition to the already louder stock exhaust which some think is to loud already. the exhaust is suprising designed well in certain areas. the pipe coming from the passengers side is 2 1/4, the pipe coming from the drivers side to the Y that is longer goes from 2in and then widens to 2 1/4. this is to keep velocity of exhaust gases at the same speed as the enter in the 2 3/4'' choked up Y. this Y is mass produced this way for cost/time efficieny and is the one major point i see choking our system hindering gas velocity. the long pipe from the Y going to the muffler is 2 1/2 keeping velocity nice and smooth , muffler openings are 2 3/8 and the out end pipes opens up t 2 3/4. it then connects to a 3" tailpipe.
one missconception is that backpressure at low loads will help low end torque. on a new engine like ours which can alter a/f conditions accodingly backpressure is our enemy. no i am not crazy lol your engine already has enough backpressure with the cats and stock headers. ill talk about headers soon. backpressure hinders the sacavenging effect and pushes gases in to the combustion chamber making your engine work harder due to loss of cumbustion effieciency = loss of power. what you want is a low backpressure system with good velocity flow, this is where tubing comes into play.
i think it was bestatchess who metioned at lower rpms your exhuast tubing should be only big enough to sufficiently expel gasses (not exact words ) and that there is no gain without a loss at another point, this is true. our stock system has a major flaw and its the Y, this creates a major velocity gas loss. the stock exhaust may be also a cork, both hinder power. adding the banks kit solves these problems by adding a nice Y collector and low backpressure muffler but also adds huge tubing. i was under the impression we has 2 7/8 tubing reading post's till i measure it for myself.
banks's 3'' tubing is quite a bit bigger then stock which will hurt the low end a bit and add to the high end like many are saying. a larger diameter pipe has less backpressure but what we care about is gas velocity flow and since its a larger pipe gas pulses will be further thus slower = the loss if power, so yes backpressure and velocity is related in a way. the question is does the tubing diameter hinder exhaust flow as much as the stock muffler and Y? i doubt it, in fact theres probably a gain because if the extreme low pressure zone created behind the header by the cat-back. you may gain across the whole band but will not have as of a efficient gain if you say cut the stock pipe, added a nice smooth Y collector and a higher flowing muffler like the banks setup if your looking into just adding a cat-back, with gains towards the low end. id do this but getting a safety check is about impossible now here with a mod cat-back so i have to buy a bolt on.
the jba cat-back looks like a very nice setup, it retains similar tubing diameter (2 1/2 to keep velocity a flowing niclely) and corrects the stock setup flaws. i doubt them humps in the piping are there to create backpressure, since we dont really care about it with a cat-back what we care about is gas velocity.(yes im gonna keep on saying it lol) they are probably there to help silence the muffler. i notice they moved the muffler way back towards the tail end and added the Y collector right by the muffler, interisting since placement affect power also. too bad its made of aluminized steel and not SS, itll probably last longer then most will have their trucks anyway lol. the nice thing about it is that JBA is designed for thier header and actually dynod a truck with their header combo which yeilded very nice gains.
not sure about gibson, i havent seen a pic yet.
now headers are a key player in complementing a cat-back. they work in conjunction with each other to help focus power at a certain point or help a few 1000 rpms out where your cat-back may not be so efficient at. they should both be better designed then stock and not cost anypower loss or almost none at any point in addition to adding power across the band if designed correctly.
after taking time to look closely at nissans work i must say im pretty impressed how close to detail they are in areas other cars ive seen are very poor. itll be very hard to gain over what nissan has layed out, jba has done very nicely and im hoping more dynos from other manufacturers will follow.
this should make up for all the post i missed lol hope i everyone didnt fall asleep now wheres that shaka smilee lol i need a long
OMG, i bear down to the almighty knowledge possesor. thanks for all the info and thats what i thought at first on the jba it was there for some sound purpose but i see what your saying on the pipe diameter. im sure that makes a difference.hopefully someone will try the jba and give thier thoughts. i agree nissan has done very well with this truck because they wanted to make a good impression on buyers. maybe ford, dodge, and chevy can learn a few things. maybe you can teach them . thanks for giving us your knowledge about this exhaustb subject
that makes all my typing worth while.
i just visited jba's site and looked at their cat-back this morning and it says that thier cat-back tubing is 3'', just like banks i emailed them to see if this is true, someone can call for a quicker responce. i then went to that ebay site selling the jba cat back and looked Very closely at the pic at the bottem. if thats for our trucks, which it may be, i wondered how the hell they run their pipe a few ft then to into the Y since theres a huge gas tank in the way. i also wondered why add even more sound dampeners to the 2 we already have. i then looked even closer and noticed that the 2 tubes with humps in them have O2 sensor bungs! it seems that the jba cat-back is a True cat-back exhaust by replacing all tubing and goes 1 step further then banks and replaces the 2 stock sound dampeners also. im just going on the pic posted on ebay here, i email jba about this also. that pic also give the impression that their tubing is only 2 1/2 up to the muffler then opens up to 3", that is if thats for our truck but if their setup is 3" like their site says, i suspect there to be little difference between it and the banks. well see what jba says....
Last edited by bighawaii : 04-11-2004 at 04:39 PM.
WOW! This CAI thread sure changed course... I started reading out of curiosity for BigHI's cut and fab project. Anxious to see the results
Now I have to ask after reading the exhaust discussion here... I have the Banks CB and am ready for headers NOW. I am not much of a waiter, Banks might take months. I find the JBA headers' price appealing, but I don't want to make the mistake of buying a pair of headers that were meant for JBA's exhaust system.
Obviously, my question is will the two different brands' exhaust components compliment eachother? specifically, I am hoping the headers will give more power to the low end where the Banks seems to divert more attention to the high end.
Secondly, I have looked at the top of the engine trying to decide how hard it would be to put the headers on myself. It looks like a BIT$@ !! Has anyone here put headers on a Titan themselves?
BigHI, if your project is successful, maybe you can beat AEM to the market and mass-produce your intake modification for that attractive price of $70. I will be looking for it on Ebay soon! Good luck
Most modifications (naturally aspirated) are gonna make the biggest difference in the mid range to top end. There's not much you can do to help the "low end". Outside of a supercharger or more cubes and compression, you aren't gonna see gains below 3000 RPM's. I don't see why everyone is so facinated with power that low anyway? If you want power at low RPM's for cruising and tip in throttle, then you bought the wrong truck. That's why they make Turbo Diesels. It's easy to add power anywhere in the powerband with them. With that said, I don't think you'll lose anything below 3k RPMs with these most basic of bolt ons. It should just make the power band less peaky and have more balance (avg power) across the tach. Running from a dead stop is the only time you'll be below 3k RPM's anyway. Even with that, you have plenty of gear in first to get the RPM's up. If you stomp the gas from a roll the truck is gonna downshift and the RPM's go way up again. Also that 10-15 hp gain on a truck that runs mid 15's in a 1/4 mile will make a much bigger difference than that same 10-15 hp on a car that runs 10's.
04-10-2004, 09:28 PM
btw i roughly measured to see if i could use the stock air box but the conical filter would have to be quite a bit smaller hindering the surface area advantage of a conical filter, but im sure it could be done. the filter i ordered is huge and isnt normal stock so might be a bit but when i get the parts ill take pics and post my results.
(We need a shakka smiley!) 
. thanks for giving us your knowledge about this exhaustb subject 
that makes all my typing worth while. 
