Rim & Tire Size Question...

[Chromematrix]

I am new here and this is actually my first posting.

I have a 2004, Titan, 4X4 (not the off road package). I am interested in getting a set of rims and tires. I do not have any lift in the truck. The suspension is strictly stock. I am thinking about 20" rims with Nitto Terra Grapplers.

My question is...will 20" rims with the Nitto Grapplers fit a stock 2004, Titan, 4x4, without rubbing the wheel wells?

If this combination won't fit, could someone suggest a rim and tire combination that would fit?

[Zoback]

it depends on the height of the tire. The nitto's are fairly big, so there is a good chance that they probably will not fit. I have seen many people with 20's on their titan, just with all season, not all terrain tires. Places like tirerack or discount tire have an online matching system that might be helpful

[Vegas04]

without lifting the truck you should look for a tire that is 33" in diameter, 11.5" wide and mount it on a rim that is less than 10" wide. The rim diameter doesn't really matter unless it is smaller than 17"
Have a good one!

[Chromematrix]

What if I put a levelling kit on the front end? What size rims and tires would then fit a 2004 Titan 4x4 (no off-road package? Does the levelling kit affect the handlling of the truck? Which kit do you guys suggest?

[TITAN220]

305/50R20's should fit w/o a leveling kit.
305/55R20's should fit w/a leveling kit.
If you want a leveling kit, get PRG's set up.
Here's some websites to check how different rims and tires should fit.
www.bigcustomwheels.com/rt_specs
http://350zx.com/tire-wheel.html
www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
John

[92TripleBlack]

Here's the post on everything tires, rims, etc. again.
I keep getting asked where I used the heat gun to melt the tire well enought to make my tires fit without rubbing. Here's a pic. I heated it up untilit was shiny, then used a screwdriver handle to hold the hot plastic in place until it cooled in new position. Anything larger on my mada and I would have had to either lift, cut or bend metal, or had rubbing.

There have been many different people asking what will and won't fit, how big is this tire, etc.

I suggest 18" stock wheel people get Michelin Cross Terrain SUV if you want all season, BFG AT if you want all terrain, or get different size rims if you want better tires.

Some tires I know nothing about:
Kumho Road Venture AT KL/78 comes in 265-70-18
Geolander H/T-S comes in 275-65-18 and 285-60-18 which are slightly shorter(1/2") and a little wider (1/2" - 1")
Yokohama AVS S/T again in 285-60-18

Not much else out there.
Tire Stuff
This is how to read the sizes and calculate the size in inches.

The stock 18" size is 265-70-18.
The first number is the width of the tread.
The second number is width of the sidewall expressed as a percentage of the tread width.
The third number is the rim diameter.

Converting, 25mm = about 1".
Using this, the tread width is 265 / 25 = 10.6" wide.
The sidewalls are (265 x 0.7) / 25 = 7.4" tall
The overall diameter is 18" (Rim) + 14.8 (Two sidewalls) = 32.8"

The stock 17" size is 285-70-17
This becomes 285 / 25 = 11.4"
(285 x 0.7) / 25 = 8" sidewall
17" + 8" + 8" = 33" overall diameter.

Using this, here are some common replacements that people like.
Yokohama Geolander H/T-S GO51 in 275-65-18
275 / 25 = 11"
(275 x 0.65) / 25 = 7.15" Sidewall.
18" + 7.15 + 7.15 = 32.3" Smaller diameter than stock by 1/2".

BF Goodrich All Terrain T/A KO in 285-65-18
285 / 25 = 11.4"
(285 x 0.65) / 25 = 7.4"
18" + 7.4 + 7.4 = 32.8"

The largest ones you can fit without lifting are 305-55-20.
This works out to
305 / 25 = 12.2"
(305 x 0.55) / 25 = 6.7"
20" + 6.7 + 6.7 = 33.4"

Larger tires in width or height will start rubbing like crazy. These actually rubbed a little on mine and I needed to melt the tire wells with a heat gun to make them fit. See here about doing this. You could go to 305-50-20, but these are slightly shorter than stock and I wanted a little taller instead. A PRG leveling kit should work instead of modifying the wells. http://www.clubarmada.com/showthread.php?t=1310

You can use this system to read any tire size and convert to see if they will fit. Smaller than 17" rims and you will have problems with the brake calipers fitting. Lower than 6" in sidewall and you will start having problems with off-road driving. Over 7" is preferred for off road. Under 5" and you will have problems on groomed dirt roads and potholes. You will also loose some ride quality and tow rating. Under 4" and you better start riding on freshly paved stretches.

The stock tires are All season Highway tires. All-season highway tires are good in most conditions but not optimal in snow or off road. The stock tires are poor examples of HWY A/S tires and really just stink in most conditions. Changing to a good quality tire will increase most tire properties. A/T tires increase poor weather traction and off road traction but add weight, may add noise, and may ride a little rougher than Highway tires. Makers can often design the tires to eliminate excess noise and rough ride.

Rim Stuff:
Stock rim sizes are 17" x 7.5" and 18" x 8".
Larger rims give you better handling (To a point) and a firmer ride. They also allow for larger brakes. You give up progressively tow rating, mileage, acceleration, smoothness of ride or ride quality, rim strength, and gain weight and cost. Forged rims are more dense and less prone to cracking than cast. This allows for either stronger rims or more delicate rim designs while retaining strength. They weigh more per amount of material used as the metal is more dense. They are usually twice or more as expensive as cast rims.

Rim width is also critical. A rim that is too narrow will pucker the tire. This may lead to the tire breaking its bead and immediately deflating, causing a crash and destroying the tire, etc. A rim that is too wide will have the rim stick out as far as the tire sidewall. This makes rims prone to scraping curbs and breaking beads as well. Check with the maker to see what width tire you should get, usually 2"-4" or so wider than the rim width.

Rims come in painted, Aluminum, and Chrome finishes. Painted is the most resistent to weather, salt, etc. Aluminum is usually brushed or polished. These require a lot of maintainence to keep looking good. Expect to do a lot of polishing. Aluminum can often be clear coated to keep most of the shine of a polished rim but give them more resistence to salt, tarnishing, etc. If this is available, I"d go this route if you choose aluminum. Chrome is the least resistent to salt but very resistent to tarnishing. You will polish, but not as much as with aluminum. Keep a good coat of wax on them and clean the brake dust off weekly and you will be fine. For salt, wash and scrub them the day you get salt on them or they may start tarnishing and pitting.

To calculate the change in diameter to find the amount the odometer is off, to this:

Diameter x 3.14 (pie) gives you the circumference.
Stock is 32.8 x 3.14 = 103 inches.
My tires are 33.4 x 3.14 = 104.9 inches.

104.9 / 103 = 1.018. Multiply this by the speed you read and you get your actual speed. 65mph x 1.018 = 66.19mph actual. Not much to worry about.

However, if you make a tire larger or smaller than the rest, say put big tires on the back, this will throw off the VDC and ABS. There is a 2-3% buffer built in for replacing a worn blown tire with a fresh new tire but put on dramatically different sizes, say a 35" with 33" tires, and you will have problems. Don't forget you need to change your spare also if you change your tires by a lot.

Q .. for those that have gone BIG .. say only to 20" .. are there wheels available (aftermarket) w/the low pressure sensors .. or by changing to aftermarket wheels do you give up that feature?

A. The pressure sensor is on the valve stem of the stock tires. If you want them, you need to dismount the stock tries, remove the sensors, and add them to the new tires. You probably will want to remount the old tires. Up to you.

Q .. by giving up the low pressure warning .. what else do you give up? I'm wondering if there are any other things tied into the low tire pressure warning system?

A. Nothing. The loss of the sensors will make a small gauge light go on from time to time. I've seen it twice in 5K miles and it goes away when you restart the engine.
Hope this helps.

[Chip Boehner]

Wow, TripleBlack....You just gave me information overload. I'm not having any luck finding stock size 17' tires other than the original equipment Bridgestone Duellers. Do you know of any other makes available?

[COTitan]

If you want a mud tire you can fit 33/12.5-R18's but you only have less then 1/2" on the wheel well without any modifying. They do look great though, but mileage goes down 10% in the city because of unsprung weight but does not change on the highway.

[Titan1080]

Originally Posted by Chip Boehner

Wow, TripleBlack....You just gave me information overload. I'm not having any luck finding stock size 17' tires other than the original equipment Bridgestone Duellers. Do you know of any other makes available?

You can get both BFG ATs and MTs in the stock 285/70/17 size. The only thing is they're not too common, you may have to wait to have them ordered from BFG. I got lucky, 4 Wheel Parts had one set of MTs at their wherehouse and it only took a week to have them shipped. Pro Comp also makes 33x12.5x17 in both AT and MT that might be a close fit without lifting. Toyo makes the Open Country AT in 285/70/17. There are plenty out there, what exactly are you looking for?

[Chromematrix]

I am looking for something that looks good.....I do prefer the larger rims (20" or more) and I do like the look of the Nitto Terra Grappler type tires.....I am just affraid of tire rubbing. I had that on a Cherokee once before and it drove me crazy......I want the larger rim with the wider looking tire.....I would like to know what width of rim I should use as well?

[Titan1080]

Originally Posted by Chromematrix

I am looking for something that looks good.....I do prefer the larger rims (20" or more) and I do like the look of the Nitto Terra Grappler type tires.....I am just affraid of tire rubbing. I had that on a Cherokee once before and it drove me crazy......I want the larger rim with the wider looking tire.....I would like to know what width of rim I should use as well?

As far as rims go, check out this thread:
20x10 Rims too big for Titan?
NissanCowgirl wanted to do the same thing you want to do. TripleBlack is the authority on large rims so ask him if you can't find your answer.

[92TripleBlack]

You shouldn't have any rubbing problems with 305-50-20. 305-55-20 will rub a little but my $20 heat gun and 5 minutes fixed that. Get a 25mm offet and 9-10" wide and you'll be fine. I'd get them at a dealer as some rims are wierd shaped and may rub the calipers. I had a problem with a set like that and had to go a little bigger offset. Hope this helps. 22" rims, you want to get 305-45-22 tires. Bigger than 22 and you're on your own. At that point you really start loosing practicality.

Here's some pics of my 20s.

[Chromematrix]

I know this is going to sound stupid, but.......I guess this is the place to ask and learn.......what do you mena by offset when you are talking about rims? I am sorry, but I am a rims and tire moran.

[Titan1080]

The Discount Tire site has an info center with a bunch of tire and wheel info. Go here for offset info:
http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/infoWheelOffsets.dos
Their info center will go a long way to making you not a "rim and tire Moron"!

[ptgarcia]

Here ya' go...