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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I am relatively new to this forum and i am purchasing a titan this weekend.

I want to give you a little of my background tho. I am new to trucks, I have owned a hemi ram for a year however.

My previous experience has been with honda B-series and K-series motors. Both N/A building and FI tuning. I have owned (and personally built) a 1.9 liter b-series honda motor to the tune of 210 whp. I am telling you this because I want to know that I am have experiences, and have had tons of cars on every dyno u can think of.

I want to say that when I first got into tuning it was with a 1999 civic SI. First thing I did was your standard breathing mods, AEM CAI, Headers, Cat eliminating 2.5" exhaust. (big for n/a honda)

As my experience grew, I had went thru several intakes, and seen dynos upon dynos of intakes.

IMO on MOST naturally aspirated motors the best intake for pure power (yielded on a dyno), is a short, fat (3 inch on honda) , smooth, linear piece of tube (like stainless, or aluminum). With a big Fat velocity stack on the end.

Often the easiest way to achieve a combo like this is get your cheapo ebay short ram intake, and get a high quality velocity stack. (that will accept a giant cone filter)

If you know anything about resonance tuning, you know that the velocity stack and the length of the pipe can permit a slight "tuning" of the powerband. (rpms @ which power is produced.)

One thing that tends to happen with cold air intakes is they do make good power, (similar to short ram, its a cfm thing really) but the can cut down on response, and extra bends affect flow, place the filter in dirtier or wet locations, etc.

What appears (to me) to be happening with titans is what myself, (and a vast majority of weekend warrior tuners) fell victim too initially. Threads and threads about which "designer" intake they used and its power. There is absolutely nothing wrong with using a designer intake (esp. if you go the dough to blow) but I am more of a bang for the buck, function over fashion intake kinda guy. (once I started building cammed up, high compression, ported motors, I stopped worrying so much about designer bolt-ons)

These motors however are different, They are very expensive, and hard to work on in comparison, and not to be toyed with by myself (unlike ez b-series) So It will be a strictly bolt-on affair with the Titan.

After all that, what I really want 2 know is has anyone used the cheapo intakes? Have dynos? Anyone have experience with velocity stacks?

Below I have a cheap-O intake that would suit perfectly to what I am describing, it even has the heat shield. All it would need is a velocity stack, and a K+N filter sized to match. (that filter it comes w. wouldnt fit anyways)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/04-0...52198QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW#ebayphotohosting


I am noticing now that this appears to be of a similar design to the nismo intakes? I will have to check how they perform. W.O any guessing I am assuming that all these intakes are performing similarly? AEM, Nismo, Volant, injen etc.

ALSO is there anyway to "tune" the fuel maps after installing these intakes? technically if the motor is benefiting from the extra CFM it should be leaning out the motor? I doubt that they are making them dangersously lean by any means but generally all these breathing mods, I/H/E etc only show their true benefit when you can tune the Air Fuel ratios. They often need fuel added in spots and fuel pulled in other spots. (Velocity stacks can further pronounce this affect, at various resonances)
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

just to give a link to what a velocity stack is, it would be similar to this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Blox...194291979QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item330194291979

If you have looked or felt around inside most cone filters, u will notice that they may have a small velocity stack built into them at the base. (not a true stack but the end is shaped similarly. It increases the speed of the air flow thru the tube.

They are used on Individual throttle bodie setups on cars, and motorcyles, and F-1 engines, etc.
 

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Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

hey welcome to TT. I like experiments but I just run out of time these days. Maybe you can try these out and see what happens. I like track times first and dynos second. These trucks can be turned into dyno queens and run slow as pigs at the track.

By the way I use a 4" irrigation tube from Homedepot to direct cooler air from the grill to my bought used volant G1 box.

I also have a buddy that has built a 4" PVC tube with cone filter that runs well.

What year truck you have?
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

I dont even have one yet!! Right now I have a hemi ram, but I am heading to the nissan dealership saturday to pick one up. I am looking at several there, between 04 and 07.

I am interested in a kingcab with offroad, heavy tow, and 6 disc changer and all power options. Theres 3 at the dealer to choose from between 04 and 07 and 20 to 40k miles. Most likely will end up with the 07, it also has the least miles, I just dont prefer blizzard white. The 04 is red brawn and I love that color but I dont really want an 04 because of the possible problems.

Either way I will end up with one, and plan on going the route I described. I will be using the dyno for comparison not to judge overall total power output but power gained for before and after. (test will be done on the same day.)

I wouldnt use the track as a judgement strictly because in my many previous experiences with a handful of different cars i can trap diff speeds (trap speed is a better show of power than ET) on the same day. Evening runs are alwayyysss gonna be higher, etc. Just the day to day atmospheric and weather changes can affect ET's. An all motor honda I had ran 3mph different at the track in october vs june. (temperature n humidity)



From what I gather the Volant appears to have been accepted as the best or one of the best (power producing) intakes available by users on titan talk. Could you please tell me the diameter of the tubing going from the throttle body to the filter box? I am guessing its 3.5 inches but if its only 3 inches it would greatly increase my options for velocity stacks.

What i would like to do, is go the the dyno, do a pass completely stock airbox, then do another with the generic Ebay intake and filter, Then swap out the filter for the velocity stack with appropriately sized filter.

All the runs will also log A:F ratios, which should point out the resonance points which may develop from the velocity stack. On several all motor hondas that we used these on, it made made 2 power "spikes" one in the mid range and another between 8,200 and 9,200 RPM. I'm not sure how these motors will react, especially seeing how it wont be turning the rpms. It should still yield a few hp over the entire powerband with any luck.
 

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stlavsa said:
From what I gather the Volant appears to have been accepted as the best or one of the best (power producing) intakes available by users on titan talk. Could you please tell me the diameter of the tubing going from the throttle body to the filter box? I am guessing its 3.5 inches but if its only 3 inches it would greatly increase my options for velocity stacks.

What i would like to do, is go the the dyno, do a pass completely stock airbox, then do another with the generic Ebay intake and filter, Then swap out the filter for the velocity stack with appropriately sized filter.
The volant is almost 3.5, but a 3 - 3 1/4" tube will work just fine (The k&N is tiny). Start with the stock air tube and airbox modifiication. The stock box has a little bung off the side with a pocket of air, this supossably helps the low end power loss of having a tube too great. All the intakes dynoed very very close. They have all been tested on one truck for comparison sake by shailey @ c l u b t i t a n . o r g .
S&B is a volant clone at a cheap price and on of the best filters i have ever used. The end is not capped off like most, it has a velosity style cone to it.

The cheap tubes are fine. The only spot to be carfull about is the maf sensor mounting area. Too flimsy of wrong diameter and you'll throw lean codes all day long, causeing the ecu to dump excess fuel due to it thinking it needs it to protect from det. hack the end of the tube off if you dont like sharp bend at the throttle body area and put a silicone 3" to 3" 90* adaptor. This will straighten it out. good luck, oh and after you drive the titan with the tow gears you wont ever worry about loosing low end power.... :upsidedow

 

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Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

Very nice to see another Honda tuner on board. Welcome and hopefully you can find a nice Titan at the dealership to your liking.

I have not played with any motor mods on my Titan yet but I would have to agree with most of what you've said. The Titan however was supposed to serve me a different purpose from my Honda. It was supposed to be my worry free, tinker and mod free vehicle.

The aftermarket support for the Titan right now appears to still be in what I would consider at it's early infant stages and experiments like these is what is needed. Unfortunately, it does not seam like there are a lot of people willing to play with their motors for now.

The only other thing to consider is that I believe a lot more people here want to be on the legal side of their tuning as opposed to the Honda world. To me personally, CARB #'s are very important.
 

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Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

HiJack....
Does the factory tow pakg give you different gearing?
 

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tre5 said:
HiJack....
Does the factory tow pakg give you different gearing?
yea so does offroad pkg. reg gears... 2:94 i believe, and BT.... 3:36, which is equal to a domestic 4:10 ratio 4 speed. (our trannies are 5 speed so different ratio #'s)
 

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stlavsa said:
I am relatively new to this forum and i am purchasing a titan this weekend.

I want to give you a little of my background tho. I am new to trucks, I have owned a hemi ram for a year however.

My previous experience has been with honda B-series and K-series motors. Both N/A building and FI tuning. I have owned (and personally built) a 1.9 liter b-series honda motor to the tune of 210 whp. I am telling you this because I want to know that I am have experiences, and have had tons of cars on every dyno u can think of.

I want to say that when I first got into tuning it was with a 1999 civic SI. First thing I did was your standard breathing mods, AEM CAI, Headers, Cat eliminating 2.5" exhaust. (big for n/a honda)

As my experience grew, I had went thru several intakes, and seen dynos upon dynos of intakes.

IMO on MOST naturally aspirated motors the best intake for pure power (yielded on a dyno), is a short, fat (3 inch on honda) , smooth, linear piece of tube (like stainless, or aluminum). With a big Fat velocity stack on the end.

Often the easiest way to achieve a combo like this is get your cheapo ebay short ram intake, and get a high quality velocity stack. (that will accept a giant cone filter)

If you know anything about resonance tuning, you know that the velocity stack and the length of the pipe can permit a slight "tuning" of the powerband. (rpms @ which power is produced.)

One thing that tends to happen with cold air intakes is they do make good power, (similar to short ram, its a cfm thing really) but the can cut down on response, and extra bends affect flow, place the filter in dirtier or wet locations, etc.

What appears (to me) to be happening with titans is what myself, (and a vast majority of weekend warrior tuners) fell victim too initially. Threads and threads about which "designer" intake they used and its power. There is absolutely nothing wrong with using a designer intake (esp. if you go the dough to blow) but I am more of a bang for the buck, function over fashion intake kinda guy. (once I started building cammed up, high compression, ported motors, I stopped worrying so much about designer bolt-ons)

These motors however are different, They are very expensive, and hard to work on in comparison, and not to be toyed with by myself (unlike ez b-series) So It will be a strictly bolt-on affair with the Titan.

After all that, what I really want 2 know is has anyone used the cheapo intakes? Have dynos? Anyone have experience with velocity stacks?

Below I have a cheap-O intake that would suit perfectly to what I am describing, it even has the heat shield. All it would need is a velocity stack, and a K+N filter sized to match. (that filter it comes w. wouldnt fit anyways)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/04-0...52198QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW#ebayphotohosting


I am noticing now that this appears to be of a similar design to the nismo intakes? I will have to check how they perform. W.O any guessing I am assuming that all these intakes are performing similarly? AEM, Nismo, Volant, injen etc.

ALSO is there anyway to "tune" the fuel maps after installing these intakes? technically if the motor is benefiting from the extra CFM it should be leaning out the motor? I doubt that they are making them dangersously lean by any means but generally all these breathing mods, I/H/E etc only show their true benefit when you can tune the Air Fuel ratios. They often need fuel added in spots and fuel pulled in other spots. (Velocity stacks can further pronounce this affect, at various resonances)
Do this - buy your titan and get the timing advanced 2* and do the airbox mod. If you don't have a hell of a smile on your face by then, bring it to my house and I'll give it a good home. :)
 

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Yep.
What he said.
2 degree advance and the airbox mod first.
Search for the airbox mod.
YOu can handle it.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

leadsled: Thank you for the dimensions that I requested. I will also look into the airbox mod? will it be necessary if I install an intake like i described?

A lean code would normally occur if getting into the system after the MAF and therefor when the ECU is in closed loop it will not be adjusting the A:F levels accordingly. Is that whats occuring? leaks?


FourDoor: Glad to hear theres another honda tuner here aswell. You are right theres nowhere near the wealth of experience or aftermarket support like on a honda camp. But thats completely expectable, its entirely different type of format.
I am not planning on getting very involved with tuning this thing. one reason is simply the cost among other things. However when I did see there are substantial gains to be made with simple bolt-ons I cannot pass up freeing up some cheap HP. It seems 10-15whp can be made with an efficient intake setup? It takes alot more than an intake to make that power on a stock b-series.


anmut: The 2 degree timing advance really makes a noteable difference? I am assuming this is just a base timing adjustment? Has anyone actually seen the software used to advance the timing? For hondas we have ROM editing software that allows you to add and subtract both fuel and timing based on load. (derivative of rpm, throttle %, manifold pressure...) I wonder if this software can handle that? or any software that can? These motors seem to be conservatively tuned and I bet there are good gains to be attained with a good custom tune.


walleemee: I am sure I can handle it. ;)
 

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Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

In terms of software gains you will probably fall along these lines (simplified):

Step 1: Get the 2* advance at your local dealership or someone else here on this board who has either a Cipher from UpRev or access to a ConsultII from the dealer. This is a one time mod that doesn't add too much flexibility but makes one hell of a change in terms of how the Titan motor runs (or so I've read since i haven't gotten mine done yet)

Step 2: Once you are in need for more power and flexibility with tuning, goto uprev.com and order yourself the Osiris/Cipher combo. Install their "default" tune, and then log some runs on your Titan. Send the logs back to UpRev and within a couple of weeks, they will send you a custom tune specific to your vehicle based on the logs you had sent them. Similar to the Honda VFAC controllers but all of the programming/tuning is done by UpRev themselves. Based on your logs, you can ask them to program 3 different types of tunes for the truck that will be accessible through button combinations on the steering wheel cruise control.
 

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stlavsa said:
leadsled: Thank you for the dimensions that I requested. I will also look into the airbox mod? will it be necessary if I install an intake like i described?

A lean code would normally occur if getting into the system after the MAF and therefor when the ECU is in closed loop it will not be adjusting the A:F levels accordingly. Is that whats occuring? leaks?
You dont need to do the airbox mod if you are getting a CAI.
Yes you are correct on the MAF sensor that is exactly what will happen. the diameter of the tube at the MAF sens should be close to stock to get a correct reading. I had problems with a tube that the material was too thin and air kept getting in causing probs. Bottom line is you can only get so much power from a simple bolt on like a CAI. Ive seen quite a difference in CFM's recorded in data logging that yeilded a very similar power increase. The next best thing would be cooling the air off with a ram air set up. Next is headers cause you can only take in air as quickly as you can get it out. The one downfall of the titan is the crappy location of the cats. They are immidiatly after the manifold and can crack and brealk apart from the extreem heat. Get some headers and highflow cats thrown into the b-pipes.

uprev is the closest thing to a custom tune you can get. Well it IS a custom tune but you do the data logging and they tune it. Maby one day they will release the software sothe user can have 100% input
 

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Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

leadsled - do you have a thread that explains your 'ram air' mod - that looks pretty cool...
 

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Clancy said:
leadsled - do you have a thread that explains your 'ram air' mod - that looks pretty cool...
Hmmm i dont think so, but RK'sTitan did on recently either here or on CT. I did a 3" and then later did a 4". Use 45* pvc bends or less. 90 will stop the flow.
 

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Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

was thinking of doing a similar mod, but with the gutter drain stuff. Just buy a 5' piece and put it where you need it. No glueing involved.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Re: Anyone using cheapo- ebay or home made intakes? Velocity stacks??? kinda long post

I didnt get the truck!! I am back to sqaure one and looking for another white one. I have to say that I am NOT a fan of the interior! I am really disappointed and I am not sure if I am going to find what i want.

I DO NOT like the captains chairs with the fixed center console. Its nice setup. I seen a titan that I did like the interior but it was in a Crew Cab. It has the split bench with the folding center console. The trucks feels so much smaller inside with the captains chairs, (and they werent very comfortable either. IMO)

Is it possible to get the split bench in the king cab? out of 5 trucks only 1 had the split bench and it was crew cab.

I am also guessing that the light tan color is the only interior color available? I seen a brawn red titan with a nice greyish interior, but can you get that with the blizzard?
 

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stlavsa said:
I didnt get the truck!! I am back to sqaure one and looking for another white one. I have to say that I am NOT a fan of the interior! I am really disappointed and I am not sure if I am going to find what i want.

I DO NOT like the captains chairs with the fixed center console. Its nice setup. I seen a titan that I did like the interior but it was in a Crew Cab. It has the split bench with the folding center console. The trucks feels so much smaller inside with the captains chairs, (and they werent very comfortable either. IMO)

Is it possible to get the split bench in the king cab? out of 5 trucks only 1 had the split bench and it was crew cab.

I am also guessing that the light tan color is the only interior color available? I seen a brawn red titan with a nice greyish interior, but can you get that with the blizzard?
I got a deal on the leather Le cause they didnt have the origional color. The The XE's i think are only ones you can get bench seats in, not sure. If you dont like the color of the cloth get these their awsome....
http://www.katzkin.com/05/FC/mainFS.html
 
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