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Discussion Starter #1
So... based on advice from someone way smarter than I, and due to my just being fed up with items relating the the Certified Pre-Owned 2012 Nissan Titan SV CC that I purchased in October from Lia Nissan of Saratoga, ... I have decided to bring Nissan USA customer service into the picture.

One of our members, who has an exhaust for sale, was kind enough, when I explained my situation, to say, instead of just taking my money, that I should try to get it warrantied.

My truck is CPO and I've only had it 2 months. The issue that pushed it over the edge for me, is that on top of all the other stuff... I found that someone had repaired the common rear exhaust flange issue with a band clamp and they sold it to me that way. I know it may last a while... but I didn't pay for a truck with cob jobs.

As I am never likely going to step foot into that dealership again... I decided to go right to Nissan Customer Service for advice on what to do next.

Some of you have read my other posts and endured my whining... for those that haven't, here is my first report here.
http://www.titantalk.com/forums/7101450-post206.html

In a nutshell...
It is my impression that they took this truck in, never did a thing to it except put 4 rotors and pads on it...and sold it to me as a CPO inspected and warrantied vehicle.
I got it home, found a lot of wrong, made a list of items that needed immediate attention and demanded they send me parts to correct the issues as they are 1hr45min away, and I didn't want them to touch it.
They were not easy to get a response from until I threatened to return the truck and call NYS DMV. (it should have never passed inspection)

They did, eventually send me the list of parts that I asked for... but, I kept, and keep, finding issues.. and I just don't feel like dealing with them. Every step with them was difficult.

So..This morning, I dialed the Nissan Customer service telephone number, they collected info... and as long as it is within my right to do so, I will share my experience here...

I emailed them a full description of my view, along with pictures of the issues, and owner info.

Lets see whats next....
 
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See if you can find a reputable Nissan dealership closer to you and tell them you want it inspected top to bottom, they shouldn't charge because no it's cpo
 

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Discussion Starter #3
While I will bring it there for warranty work, as they will get paid for it from Nissan, I just wouldn't feel right going to the local dealership, who I didn't buy the truck from and ask them to do the inspection, that the dealer who I gave money to didn't do.

I worked at a full service NAPA store (full machine shop, custom hydraulic hoses, etc...) for a long long time...and I used to get so mad when people who never shopped at nor stepped foot in our store, would buy parts from the AutoZones and Car Quests a town over, who had college kids that knew nothing working the counter... or buy online... and then call us for torque specs or to say "my car does this after i changed the that" and ask for help. I have some real interesting stories... people can be truly amazing in their expectations.

That said.. if Nissan directs me to go to them, I will do so...because I assume they will get some benefit, or have some contract as a dealer to so.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Here's a pic of the exhaust fix... I'm not saying the dealer did this, just that they sold it to me like this.

Also attached, are pics of what they reported to CarFax as.. the "new" air filter(at least 20k on it), the "new" cabin air(MIA), the electrical system checked(fuse box left open), and the right side e-brake under the rotors they replaced.
 

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what is leaking or creating a mess under your truck? man that looks pretty knarly...

although, that 360° clamp is probably better than what was there. The original owner may have foreseen that joint failing and took care of it. It`s not a bad thing as long as it is tight.

the rest of the stuff, it just looks like a lazy person went over the truck and they didn`t want to spend any money with replacing a few items...

I`d be more concerned with that mess under the truck...
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Here is an excerpt from the Carfax on this truck that the dealer provided... I bought the truck on 10/1

CARFAX Vehicle History Report for this 2012 NISSAN TITAN S/SV/SL... https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistory/p/Report.cfx?vin=1N6AA0EJ0...

09/09/2016 65,067 Lia Nissan of Saratoga
Malta, NY
518-886-4800
lianissansaratoga.com

Vehicle offered for sale


09/10/2016 Nissan Certified Dealer
Ballston Spa, NY

Offered for sale as a Nissan Certified Pre-Owned vehicle
Certification includes:
7-year/100,000-mile limited warranty
Comprehensive 167 point vehicle inspection
Roadside Assistance for the full warranty period


09/12/2016 Lia Nissan of Saratoga
Malta, NY
518-886-4800
lianissansaratoga.com

Pre-delivery inspection completed
Air filter replaced
Body electrical system checked
Brake pads replaced
Brake rotor(s) replaced
Cabin air filter replaced/cleaned
Exhaust system checked
Oil and filter changed
Rear suspension checked
Safety inspection performed
Steering/suspension checked
Washed/detailed
Wiper(s) replaced
Emissions inspection performed


10/1/2016 10:06 PM
Get this vehicle's maintenance schedule, service history
and recall alerts at myCARFAX.com.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
what is leaking or creating a mess under your truck? man that looks pretty knarly...

although, that 360° clamp is probably better than what was there. The original owner may have foreseen that joint failing and took care of it. It`s not a bad thing as long as it is tight.

the rest of the stuff, it just looks like a lazy person went over the truck and they didn't want to spend any money with replacing a few items...

I`d be more concerned with that mess under the truck...

HEHEHE :) That is Upstate NY Snirt (snow/dirt) melting in my garage at lunch time today :)
(no worries, that mess will be dry soon, heated garage)

While I agree the band clamp it isn't a terrible fix... it isn't correct (and the pipe is not great).
I can however confidently say that that stainless band clamp will outlast the tailpipe, which is probably not going to last another 6 months. And.. the CarFax reports that they checked the exhaust.

The original owner is, according to the very long story I was told about how well this truck was cared for, and how babied it was its whole life, the father of the Sales Manager at the dealership I bought the truck from... who, according to that Sales Manager, always had the truck serviced explicitly by their own service department, noone else was allowed to touch it, because of how thoroughly and carefully they serviced his truck. If what I am told is true... I am assuming that he never touched a wrench to this beast.

As to the "rest of the stuff"... and maybe just a lazy inspection...
NYS DMV inspection requires a working e-brake, and all lights to function...neither of which condition was true... they broke the law by passing it without testing the e-brake or looking at the backup lamps. (it was the socket corroded badly... not a bulb.. so no way it went out on the way home)

No one... lazy or otherwise... went over this truck at all... I am assuming that they replaced pads and rotors because they had to.. probably metal to metal...and, you could see those shiney new parts through those beautiful 20" rims...

I expect dealers to skimp and do things as cheap as possible... that improves their profit margin. Fair Game..
What is shameful however, is that they showed me an itemized list of things they said were completed, with a total cost to them listed...while negotiating... that they didn't do any of (except the pads and rotors)... and... they reported those things to Carfax... and, when I mentioned that I didn't believe any dealer actually did the whole CPO inspection aside from one I ever dealt with (Orange Mazda in Albany is Excellent... but both other dealers I bought CPO cars from left rats nests.. yes really..animal feces and shredded stuff, under the hoods), They assured me that I need not worry about their CPO inspection, they were dedicated to the Nissan CPO Program.

Leads me to think... How many of the other service history items...listed as performed at this dealership, and listed on the CarFax were fabricated? I based my decision to purchase this vehicle, on information that may have been completely fabricated.

They didn't even bother to check the coolant level, or turn on the lights and walk around the truck... just look at them, and then lied about having changed 20$ worth of wiper blades... hehehe .. it wasn't just lazy.

I'm dying to see what Nissan will do to make this right... I hope they amaze me.
 
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Discussion Starter #10
Looks like your pinion seal is starting to leak.
EH... the pinion seal was fine when I did the axle vent mod. The wet stuff is either melting Snirt, or it could be Carwell overspray ( I got a little free spritzing the rest of what I had left in the bottle around)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I forgot... I have more experience to add... Just in case you are considering Lia Nissan of Saratoga as a dealer.

I didn't keep every email.. so I don't have all the exact dates... (I thought I was done with them for a while...and gmail only keeps 30 days in the trash, so I lost some forever)

Near the end of October, I emailed the dealer(salesman and sales manager) to let them know I had a couple of leaking TPMS sensors.
The TPMS light had come on... pressure was low in the right front, I didn't think much of it, aired it up, figured they just never checked that either... 'til one quiet evening in the garage, I heard the squeaky leaky sounds only a leaking valve stem can make... tried tightening, then loosening wiggling, then re-tightening...and got it to stop... a day or two later heard another one.. same thing... then checked the first... and it was leaking again...so 2 of 4... As this dealer has, according to Carfax, done all of the tire changes(2x) and rotations... I assume they just never changed these seals.

I don't know about you guys... but I put new valves in when I change tires...nothing like a bad 3$ part screwing up a $150 tire right? ... I feel TPMS o-rings or seals to be the equivalent of a rubber valve stem... maybe I'm wrong.. but these leak... so I'm at least 50% right.

I emailed the salesma and sales manager, to ask if they see about having service send me TPMS rebuild kits ($3 each)...told em two were leaking, but maybe they could just send 4.... again... stating that I would just take care of installing them to avoid the trip. They didn't get back to me... it had been maybe a week.

(I don't know about you... but if I had pulled all that S#!t with a customer, they did with me, then got caught doing it, and the customer was decent about it... I probably would have at least answered the email that day or the next)

Around this time, I was also wondering if they had actually registered me with Nissan as a CPO customer, as I am sure that costs them money, felt they mighta tried to sneak that outta that cost too... and, I had not yet received anything from Nissan USA about CPO program membership, Roadside, Etc... No Surveys... nothing... as I had with Mazda and Chevrolet when I bought CPOs from them.

So this is what happened next... (names removed because I'm afraid they are going to start sending cease and desist lawyer letters soon if they read this forum... But I'll share those on here too if I get them...)

Subject... 2012 Titan Nissan Ceritification
3 messages
BWV Wed, Nov 2, 2016 at 6:59 PM

To: *****@liacars.com, *******@liacars.com>
Hello Gentlemen,
Am I supposed to get something from Nissan relating to the Nissan Certified program?
I haven't seen anything yet.

Also,
Still waiting on an answer about the TPMS sensors leaking... should I just call your service department directly?
Thanks


BWV Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 11:16 PM
To: *****@liacars.com, *******@liacars.com>
Hi Guys,
Should I just call?
Is there someone else I should be emailing.
Thanks



*****@liacars.com> Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 9:45 AM
To: BWV
Yes sorry please call service.
518-886-4800
*****
Sales Manager
Lia Nissan of Saratoga
Phone 518-886-4800
Fax 518-886-4899

Nice huh?
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
In all fairness to the dealership... I never called the service department about the stem seals... I can buy these kits on Amazon for less than the therapy will cost to recover from any more dealings with them.
At that point I just felt completely done with dealing with them...


Out of curiosity.. I just googled TPMS Seal Replacement... Shrader says this:

"Just as important, Service Packs should be replaced each and every time a tire is changed, rotated, or replaced as recommended by the Rubber Manufacturers Association (RMA). Service Packs provide the critical sealing components for each applicable sensor (clamp-in or snap-in) and should be replaced just as valve stems are today."

I attached the whole TPMS Q&A i found... lots of interesting info...
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Update
The Nissan regional rep called my cell phone yesterday morning ..I did not have service, so she left a message that she would call me back Wednesday.

I tried to return her call from a "land line" a half hour later by the caller ID number...that didnt work... so I got a direct number for her from the 1800Nissan1 line, left a message yesterday with contact info, got no response, so left another today...

I hope I can catch the call tomorrow morning.

To add to the fun, I found out today, that somewhere between the dealer... the bank who they used.. and the bank that now has my loan... the last three digits of my Vin number got mixed up... so there's that to add to the pile. (on top of the14 phone calls and 12 hours total I spent on hold last month with them to get the automatic payments fixed...)

And.. did I mention that a slate roof tile fell 30+ feet off the roof of one of the places I work last week and landed on the hood...slid down the hood, down the grill and onto the bumper... it's ugly.

You just cant make this stuff up...

That said... Life is good... I am warm, dry, and eat every day... everyone should have such problems right???

I do really enjoy this truck. :) Once we get past all this fun stuff... I'm sure we'll have a long happy life together.
 
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So.. I got ahold of the Nissan Rep.

I asked her if she thought she could tell me anything.
I asked her if she read my email and looked at the pictures.
She said yes she looked at it.
I asked if what she thought.... she asked me to explain my issues.
I talked for 15 minutes.. stopped, ans said, is this what you need me to explain. She said yes, go on.
I went on for another 15 minutes, stopping to ask if she was still happy with how i was explaining.
When I got done, she asked me what I would like her to do.
I said I would like you to arrange for a different dealership to look at the exhaust, and if bad replace it, and, asked if she could have them check for a loose ball-joint or reason for the front end clunk.
She said that, because it was a previously owned vehicle, she could not help me.
I explained that it is a NISSAN certified vehicle, she said she understood that, but I would need to take it to the dealer.
I asked if I could take it to another dealer. She said I could take it to any NISSAN dealer.
I said, so if i take it to a different dealer they will take care of it? she said she was not a mechanic, so could not answer that.
I said.. wont there be a fee for them to look at it? do you cover that? she said No sir.
I said will there be a fee, she said yes most dealers charge a diagnostic fee. I said.. for a band clamp on a tail pipe? she said yes.
I said, so, when you read my email, did you know that this was the answer?
She said yes... I said then why in the world would you allow me to go on for 38 minutes?
She said because she didn't want to interrupt me.
I said are you positive there is nothing you can do for me?
She said yes, thank you.
I said have a nice day, I usually say thank you.. but in this case you have only wasted my time. goodbye.

So.. there it is.
 
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So.. I got ahold of the Nissan Rep.

I asked her if she thought she could tell me anything.
I asked her if she read my email and looked at the pictures.
She said yes she looked at it.
I asked if what she thought.... she asked me to explain my issues.
I talked for 15 minutes.. stopped, ans said, is this what you need me to explain. She said yes, go on.
I went on for another 15 minutes, stopping to ask if she was still happy with how i was explaining.
When I got done, she asked me what I would like her to do.
I said I would like you to arrange for a different dealership to look at the exhaust, and if bad replace it, and, asked if she could have them check for a loose ball-joint or reason for the front end clunk.
She said that, because it was a previously owned vehicle, she could not help me.
I explained that it is a NISSAN certified vehicle, she said she understood that, but I would need to take it to the dealer.
I asked if I could take it to another dealer. She said I could take it to any NISSAN dealer.
I said, so if i take it to a different dealer they will take care of it? she said she was not a mechanic, so could not answer that.
I said.. wont there be a fee for them to look at it? do you cover that? she said No sir.
I said will there be a fee, she said yes most dealers charge a diagnostic fee. I said.. for a band clamp on a tail pipe? she said yes.
I said, so, when you read my email, did you know that this was the answer?
She said yes... I said then why in the world would you allow me to go on for 38 minutes?
She said because she didn't want to interrupt me.
I said are you positive there is nothing you can do for me?
She said yes, thank you.
I said have a nice day, I usually say thank you.. but in this case you have only wasted my time. goodbye.

So.. there it is.

Calling bullsh*t on her!! I bought my truck at Nissan of north Plainfield in NJ and they are absolute sh*t. When I installed my Banks last week I noticed a SIZEABLE amount if oil dripping out of my front transfer case, truck has 10K miles (6 miles on the odometer when I bought 7 months ago) so I decided that's a bit more than just a tiny leak. I wet back to have them check and they said a bolt was loose and it was no big deal, so I asked did you check the fluid level to see how much leaked out? Tech said "no, and why would I do that?" im no mechanic but a leak that bad in only 10K miles, im sure there's just a bit of oil missing. So I called Nissan of Bridgewater and they offered me a free loaner vehicle while they checked the fluid levels etc, there's no charge from them to me because I have a warranty, as you do yours. They shouldn't charge you if its covered under warranty, shouldn't matter what dealership you go to. Now if you go to a private mechanic in your town then they would charge you. Anyone can correct me if im wrong lol.
 

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So.. I got ahold of the Nissan Rep.

...

I said are you positive there is nothing you can do for me?
She said yes, thank you.
I said have a nice day, I usually say thank you.. but in this case you have only wasted my time. goodbye.

So.. there it is.
Wow. I guess the upshot of this is that if you find a good local dealer, who takes care of issues well, "hang on to them..."
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I sent an email to the Nissan rep, asking her if she was sure that she didnt want to help, because I am considering taking this to the attorney general, the BBB and possibly the press... I haven't gotten an answer back, and don't expect one.
I think that avenue is dead...

You wont believe this story..

So.. ironically... the closest Nissan dealership to me(30 miles away), Country Club Nissan, used to be a Chevrolet dealership... The very same Chevrolet dealership that sold me my very first Certified Pre-Owned car... a 2003 Impala LS.
That car purchase was my first glimpse into how egregious a dealership could be towards a customer. That car had a rat's nest under the plastic engine cover when I got it home (I mean chewed up fuzz, feces, pee, acorns, seeds...filled the intake valley) and then some. But that's a whole other story...

The key bit of information I am sharing here... is that the service manager at the time, actually said to me, and I quote.. "If you wanted a new car, you should have bought a new car... you bought a used car, they all have issues" ...while negotiating what they would do to make right with that car... which, I feel they did do.
Shortly after that... with all the problems that car had (I kept it less than 2 years), I traded it in on my very first brand new car... from the same dealer (yet another story as to why I did), a Chevy Equinox for my wife... the year that model was introduced.
Well, it had a few issues, and at one point I said to that same service manager, "Well Bob, ya told me if I wanted a new car, to buy one, so I did... and its still a piece of s#!t, any idea what to do next?"... I was probably a little rude, and over the top...and we didn't part on good terms.

He was without work shortly after that... I didn't do anything directly to cause it, but I sure did think to myself... "Karma"

I just found out today... that this gentleman (who lives in my community, and who I have been very pleasant when we cross paths) is now the service manager for the local Nissan dealership. So.. as you can imagine, I am just dying to call him for help...

Who'd a thunk it?... Again.. you just cant make this stuff up.

So...
I may call the service department of the dealer I bought this truck from and ask if the exhaust pipes, front end clunk, and tpms seals are covered by CPO warranty, or if they want to make right by me out of decency. They at the very least owe me an answer to the warranty policy questions... and then if so, I'll see if they can work it so that I can have it done at the local dealer.

If not... I will finish debating in my head as to if I should call the attorney general in and report this to the BBB.

I dunno... I'm tired of stressing over it and want to begin looking at this truck in a positive light. Maybe just spending a couple a hundys out of pocket and taking care of it myself will end this.

So I dont seem like someone who is just too fussy...I will share that I have now purchased a total of 5 CPO program cars from various dealerships.
Two of those experiences were exemplary, "They way it should be" experiences. Those were both from Orange Mazda in Albany NY.
The above mentioned Chevy was bad, but not horrific.
The Mazda I bought from Kelly Mazda in Scranton PA was worse than this Nissan experience... if the dealer wasn't almost 3 hours away, I probably woulda driven it through their front window.

I think I've done enough whining to this group and I want to begin adding to the positive energy this forum...
 

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Really, I don't think you need to negotiate the CPO terms with the purchase-place dealer. If you have the CPO paperwork in good order, you can take it to any Nissan dealer, and there should be no questions asked about coverage. Maybe that gets most of your issues, but it wouldn't surprise me if prior "fixes" like the exhaust, if deemed functional, won't be included.

I don't think a letter to AT and BBB are out of line.

Good luck!
 
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Discussion Starter #19
HOLY CRAP!! I have yet to have a good experience with Nissan Customer Care

SO.. I believed I had a (1) wheel bearing failing. So, didnt want to bother with the dealer... ordered a Timken Hub Assembly from Amazon Warehouse deals .. box damage only.. 72$ .. such a deal.

I'm figuring.. even if this is covered under the Certified Pre Owned warranty.. there's a $50 deductible..If i do it myself, it's gonna cost me $22 more, a couple hours in the Gragg, and a couple cold ones to celebrate afterward... Garage time=Free therapy.. so..its a wash.

I shoulda done this first..but, I'm an idiot.. so I didn't... Tonight I go out, jack up the truck, shake the wheels.. passenger side feels like about 1/4 play, clunk, clunk, clunk... drivers side.. maybe 32nd inch.. tink tink tink... I feel around, crawl under, wiggle wiggle.. verify this is in the hub/bearing unit.. not ball joints, etc..

I get out the dial indicator (just curious) ..at the fattest part of the sidewall of the tire.. .080 (80 thousandths) and .045 (45 thousandths) play... I'd say 2 shot now.

Wondering if CPO warranty covers these, so I call 1-800-NISSAN3 for details... they direct me to a "warranty specialist"... 30 minute phone call.. I know as much now as I did before the call...
The call was an absolute mistake... the guy, right out of the box, starts arguing (I was exceptionally polite the entire time..mom would be proud..) that there are different versions that may not cover this..."as a used vehicle, nothing may be covered anymore as the factory warranties have expired", and on and on, depending on what aftermarket warranty I bought, and I should call the place i bought the truck..., "what warranty did I buy". I said I didn't buy a warranty.. i bought a CPO truck, with a CPO Nissan warranty 7yr,100k powertrain...
He is looking at my VIN, my "policy number" etc...telling me when I bought it, when the factory warranties expired, and actually said "i see your extended warranty policy number"...So I'm trying to explain.. I got the base version of the CPO warranty that comes with any Nissan CPO vehicle you buy. Asked to speak to "whoever he would ask for help if he had a question he couldn't answer"...he said couldnt do that.. I asked (nicely) if i could speak to his supervisor.. he said one could call me in 4-8 business hours. And on.. and on..I thanked him, said have a nice evening...

Gonna call the dealer tomorrow, no matter how much I hate to do it.

So now.. My dilemna... if i decide to buy another bearing and DIY this, it's $114.88 more than the $72 i got out now (I can return this one).

My dilemma...
Do I pay the $50 deductible (if these are covered... i believe they are), allow someone else to work on my truck, trust a dealership to do the right thing, give up the truck for maybe a day... drop off one night, pick up the next day or later... hope that they don't screw up ordering parts, breaking bolts.. etc...and take a week or two (been there...)

If i go the warranty route.. 2 hours driving back and forth for 2 people (do they provide a rental? I'm assuming no..but maybe they do.)
Gas out and back...30 miles each way if i go local (truck 60 miles, wife's Rogue 120 miles) =~8 gallons @2.75= $22
$50 deductible
Worry.. cant assign a value to that...
If.. this turns into "one of those nightmares" (I'm a magnet for those...) aggravation..
total cost.. $72 at least...

OR

do I spend 72+118+my time to do this myself and feel comfortable that it is done properly and done when I want to do it?
Total cost =$190

Doing the math ... $190 (my parts done at my home) -72 (if all goes well...dealer + gas to drop)= it will cost me at most $118 more than the warranty work would cost if they don't stick me with some hidden costs or some "shop supply surcharge"...

So.. seeking advice here... does anyone believe I can get both failed wheel front bearings replaced for just the $50 deductible my CPO warranty has?

I'd love to hear your thought, ideas, success or horror stories...

BTW... My transfer case is a little noisy (paranoia...) I'd like them to listen to it if they have the truck anyway...
 

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They can do both hubs in about 4 hours, they did one of mine while I waited, pulled in at 8 am was out by 10 am. That included probably 20-25 minutes of the tech trying to get the rotor off using a air hammer and chisel, damn salty a55 roads around here....
 
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